Make security "age restricted"

[DyssalC]

It makes brigging petty criminals a hassle as you have to sit there and watch them for however long their sentence is so they don't break a window with a chair. Other servers have a Warden job for this reason.

Yes, the playerbase has issues with being locked up. You don't need a special warden to keep watch though, you can always nominate one of your officers to keep watch.

Would additional [security-access] riot suppression gear or objects help? If so, what sort?

Remember that thread a long time ago about 40mm grenade improvements?

Let me just...
http://forum.ss13.co/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3736
Ya there we go.

[Paineframe]

More ideas with the above to balance it out:
Add like 1-2 bath salt tablets hidden in the sec toilet so prisoners can resist a stun at the cost of being a raving lunatic.

Add the ability to damage cameras with blunt force. Arrange the cameras in the brig so that there's camera directly in the brig. This way a prisoner can knock out a camera so the security can't yell at the AI to bolt down the brig for them.

Move remove both disposals from security proper. It's just too easy to escape down into the trash. Instead put it one disposal in security foyer so this way prisoners have to bust more than one window to escape to freedom.

I like the bath salts idea. Not only for the robusting potential, but because it's a tricky drug to cook in general, despite being pretty useful especially for traitors. It gives people an incentive to go get into the brig (one way or another) so they can pocket some bath salts for use later.

The cameras, I'm not so sure about. If its too easy to break the cameras, all the cameras will be broken, and people rarely fix cameras.

The third, no way. I use that disposal chute all the time as a sec officer to bail out when the situation in sec goes sour.

[Dauntasa]

...And this is where we differ because I think there IS a way to make more secure than it already is without making it gestapo. Imo adding anything to the brig right now is an improvement as it's just full on "option a" at the moment. It needs discussion rather than saying "nope can't be done, sorry, move on" otherwise we'll get this constant cyclic bullshit of these security threads cropping up.

I feel like a hos should be forced to spawn every round, just like a captain. Also, put ir beams outside the brig windows that send you a pda message if tripped, so you know some jerk is breaking out (or in) through the windows.

Some blast doors you can toggle would be useful too

This is one of those things that i'm talking about, dauntasa take note.
Adding an IR beam that alerts sec via pda was something that has been suggested before and it's a good idea. Having blast door toggles are also good. This ties in with the TV in brig so prisoners can look when an appropriate time to escape.

More ideas with the above to balance it out:
Add like 1-2 bath salt tablets hidden in the sec toilet so prisoners can resist a stun at the cost of being a raving lunatic.

Add the ability to damage cameras with blunt force. Arrange the cameras in the brig so that there's camera directly in the brig. This way a prisoner can knock out a camera so the security can't yell at the AI to bolt down the brig for them.

Add a beaker in the brig so prisoners can fill it full of water to slip up officers who go in, but also if they have spec glasses that they can check to see what's in ??? pill and if they are any use.

Move remove both disposals from security proper. It's just too easy to escape down into the trash. Instead put it one disposal in security foyer so this way prisoners have to bust more than one window to escape to freedom.

Put locks on the damn security pods.

Put a money bail device in security brig so if prisoners play the slot machine and win big or if they have money anyway, they can shove money in and activate their automated chute. Security can set bail on the timer, and any money that is put in is automatically put back into station budget.

The IR beams are an alright idea. Everything else kind of isn't.

Removing the disposals and locking all the pods takes you straight to supermax deathfort because in that case even if they manage to escape the actual cell they're stuck in the brig foyer unless security left a mech toolbox in there because, and correct me if I'm wrong here because I don't necessarily have this perfectly memorized, the windows leading from the brig to the sec foyer are blocked by tables/computers. And if they aren't this doesn't exactly make sec's job any easier, it just means they have twice as much damage to repair after a breakout.

Adding useful items for prisoners to the brig is pretty much worthless because I guarantee you within a week of them being added sec would start every round by going and collecting them. The only reason they don't do that with the arcade machines is because they're stuck to the floor.

It doesn't matter if the AI can bolt the brig or not because prisoners can't open the door anyway.

If you added blast doors within a week standard sec practice would be to immediately shut them behind any prisoner who was thrown in unless they were specifically banned from doing that, in which case nobody would EVER use them for fear of being banned.

The bail machine won't work just because if sec searches you you aren't going to have any money and if sec doesn't search you you can just break out. For this to get used sec has to search you, decide to brig you, and then specifically give you your money back so you can escape the brig faster.

The IR beams I kind of like just because they would mean you'd have to actually deal with sec during an escape instead of just waiting for them to leave, which I think would make the brig less functionally useless while also making escape remain possible. I think this idea is as close as you can actually get to striking that balance.

[Frank_Stein]

The bail machine won't work just because if sec searches you you aren't going to have any money and if sec doesn't search you you can just break out. For this to get used sec has to search you, decide to brig you, and then specifically give you your money back so you can escape the brig faster.

Are you stealing people's cash as Sec? Who do you think you are, the NYPD?

A bail console for minor crimes would be great. Allow prisoners to pay their way out, as well as people in the visiting area.

[Dauntasa]

The bail machine won't work just because if sec searches you you aren't going to have any money and if sec doesn't search you you can just break out. For this to get used sec has to search you, decide to brig you, and then specifically give you your money back so you can escape the brig faster.

Are you stealing people's cash as Sec? Who do you think you are, the NYPD?

A bail console for minor crimes would be great. Allow prisoners to pay their way out, as well as people in the visiting area.

sec takes off your backpack and empties your pockets before they brig you. This has the side effect of making you drop your cash, given that it is going to either be in your pockets or backpack. So, 100% of the time, before you get thrown into the brig, your cash is going to be taken from you just as part of searching you.

So, unless the officer arresting you specifically gives you the cash back, you aren't going to have any.

[Berrik]

As far as breakouts go, I have literally gotten yelled at by admins for using rwalls to make genpop less easily escapable. Apparently screaming shitcurity repeatedly over the radio and then breaking out of jail with your shoes is a god-given right.

[Frank_Stein]

I mean, I play Sec often. I usually return anything to their bag after a search if it's not going to be a problem to let them keep it.

If they don't do that, you should ask them to.

[Paineframe]

He does raise a good point, though, in that if a sec officer goes through the trouble of dragging somebody all the way to sec and brigging them, they are highly unlikely to be okay with that person running straight to the bail machine and releasing themselves in ten seconds flat, and will quickly learn to take measures to prevent it.

[Sundance]

1. Bail is optional. If an officer does not want the prisoner to leave the jail, then he can either not set bail, or set the bail to a ridiculously high number.
"BAIL IS 1 MILLION CREDITS" *twists mustache and laughs crazily

2. I was just thinking that the bail machine works off the credits on your card and not the cash in pocket. The reason for this is numerous.
Firstly chances are when you are brigged that you will have your ID, if not then it's more than likely you had security access, boo hoo.
Secondly it allows you to use the slots via swiping the ID. If the brig is harder to break out of, and slots are available to speed up the process, then bail COULD be set to a high enough number to the point where nanotrasen may be making a profit from space lottery, while paroling convicts due to their opulence instead of their crime. In reality, this would be racketeering . On ss13 this just seems like a fun way of adding in a "privatized prison" feel to the brig.

If you added blast doors within a week standard sec practice would be to immediately shut them behind any prisoner who was thrown in unless they were specifically banned from doing that, in which case nobody would EVER use them for fear of being banned.

Then design them to work like fire alarms in which they reset after x amounts of seconds. Nobody wants the brig to be sealed up tight behind blast doors, and having them reset after x amount of time is just a simple solution to this as the blast doors are meant to stop escape when escape is occurring, not prevent escape before it is occurring.

The cameras, I'm not so sure about. If its too easy to break the cameras, all the cameras will be broken, and people rarely fix cameras.

Yeah point taken. Then there should be a tool that allows you to break cameras that can be constructed within the brig.
A shiv for example would be good thing to act as a wirecutters.
Shiv = glass shard + cloth. Cloth can be made by ripping up clothing with the glass shard.
This way, you may sacrifice your clothing whether it be your hat or shoes or gloves or even jumpsuit to make cloth to take out a camera.
The shiv also doubles as a knife, if that wasn't obvious.

The camera btw is not to bolt the doors, that wasn't what I meant, I meant to prevent the AI from using the blast doors on the prisoner.
Take out the camera, check if officers are around, start busting out, alarm goes off, security aren't about, yell for ai to activate blast doors, ai cant because his camera is disabled, raises the prisoners chance of escaping.

Essentially what i'm getting at it is making the brig harder to break out of, but do it in such a manner that gives the prisoners more options at escaping than just the way we have now.

[mozi]

It makes brigging petty criminals a hassle as you have to sit there and watch them for however long their sentence is so they don't break a window with a chair. Other servers have a Warden job for this reason.

Yes, the playerbase has issues with being locked up. You don't need a special warden to keep watch though, you can always nominate one of your officers to keep watch.

Would additional [security-access] riot suppression gear or objects help? If so, what sort?

Having to watch the brig is not fun. It's as much punishment as being in the brig. A purposefully bad brig means sec officers doing their job have to take the same timeout as a bored jerk

[Paineframe]

Why not just not give the brig a window that's trivial to break out through? There's no reason to bother with elaborate jailbreaks if the brig is too easy to break out of solo with minimal preparation or tools.

[Nubcake]

I still stand by my ir beams embedded in the brig windows idea. And maybe some in the armoury too, but perhaps thats going too far? Or just make the brig windows out of plasma glass or something that takes longer to break out of

[Berrik]

The armory already has IR beams around the perimeter, but I think only the AI gets alerts from them.