Goonhub
12-26-2024, 12:38 AM
(This post was last modified: 12-26-2024, 02:10 PM by ithebinman. Edited 38 times in total.)
Just an idea to add Piranha Solution (famous acid oxidizer that can eat through and dissolve just about any organic matter) into ss13.
the IRL mix ratio is usually: a 3:1 mixture of sulfuric acid and 30% hydrogen peroxide. And notably, the H2O2 must be added second and at not a too high amount or the mixture will become unstable and bubble out of the beaker or explode.
I'll just add this here from wikipedia:
currently hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) doesn't exist in the game.... or does it?
Space cleaner is essentially H2O2, but perhaps for a recipe that has potentially explosive and highly corrosive outcomes needs to be a bit more balanced!
Upon some research, H2O2 in it's consumer form is essentially space cleaner, however, for a highly concentrated version that would be used in Piranha Solution, it would need to be something closer to High-Test Peroxide a chemical itself that is intensely powerful and used as a propellant in modern rocketry. The concentration of this chem would serve as the main balance for creating Piranha Solution, and therefore should arguably take 10 minutes for someone (who knows what they're doing) to synthesize about 200u.
- Additional info from Wikipedia about High-Test Peroxide:
SO, how does one concentrate H2O2? (space cleaner)
One way funnily enough it's by adding sulfuric acid, which creates Piranha Solution, but, when both are put in a sealed container in separate beakers with phosphorus pentoxide, after some time (IRL days-weeks) it concentrates it! (it's a lot more convoluted than this, but this is a game, not a chemistry lesson.)
In game, we could see this as a recipe of: space cleaner (H2O2 unconcentrated) + sulfuric acid + a phosphorus based chem that acts as a desiccant, so either smoke powder or Photophosphide (smoke powder makes more sense, but both have their dangers if exposed to their ignition source). + a stabilizer + The final most important ingredient, TIME.
TLDR recipe for High Test Peroxide (HTP): space cleaner + sulfuric acid + smoke powder + stabilizing agent + time (in a beaker with a lid).
What this process would do is slowly concentrate the space cleaner into HTP, which then (so as not to instantly remove the HTP) would slowly mix with the sulphuric acid to create Piranha Solution. At this point though, as the amount of Piranha solution is created, the hotter the beaker should be getting, causing the smoke powder to ignite if exposed to the air. Another issue is that at a certain temperature, sulphuric acid will break and shatter the beaker! This is where things get a little messy around the dangers of synthesising it, so let's just say if there's an over abundance of HTP to sulphuric acid ratio, causing heat... BOOM!
This synthesis is a bit silly, so perhaps the existence of a stabilizing agent stops the sulphuric acid and HTP from mixing right away, but will slowly deplete as more HTP is synthesised, meaning you would need to continually top it up to avoid explosion.
Another potential recipe is the distillation of the space cleaner in a vacuum under heat.
This would be a much simpler recipe= space cleaner + stabilizing agent + heat ~50-60C + Time in a closed beaker = separating the space cleaner into water and a minimal amount of HTP over some time.
This is much less dangerous without the presence of smoke powder or sulphuric acid, but it makes a bit more sense.
One property that should be present in HTP is that if left in a sealed container, the build-up of oxygen gas will eventually also cause a BOOM! This forces a chemist who is synthesising it to constantly be working to move the HTP out of the distillation or desiccation process mix as both methods would eventually explode with a sealed lid.
For more on H2O2 see these vids:
Explosions and Fire Hydrogen Peroxide
Improper Footwear with High Test Peroxide (essentially real life Phlogiston!)
Back to Piranha Solution:
The major reaction upon applying the solution to organic matter (flesh, clothes, anything made of carbon) should be after a cycle or two, the release of water vapor, CO2 and Hydrogen gas, the intense heat generated by the reaction, and finally the conversion of all organic matter into carbon liquid, bones and all. As the solution is used up, it is replaced with the liquid carbon from the organic source until there is nothing left but carbon and sulphur (the sulphuric acid reducing back into it's elemental form).
When mixed incorrectly, depending on the concentration of H2O2, there would be a small 1x1 to 3x3 explosion that would additionally spray the solution as a liquid around, best you or your friends aren't around when this happens!
On TOUCH I would imagine quite a bit of BURN damage, on higher concentration it may even melt arms and legs (or skin!), causing BRUTE damage.
On INGEST I would imagine similar or worse BURN damage with the addition of melting your organs like your stomach which would then need to be replaced. (not sure why you would drink this but to each their own).
Bathing in it would result in a total liquification of your body after some time, but you will probably be dead from BURN damage before this happens.
With these properties I realise it can be absolutely over powered, but I believe the danger in mixing the solution, and the time spent concentrating the H2O2 to High-Test Peroxide makes up for it.
Why should this be added?
- It gives chemistry a fun new (unstable!) chemical that has various uses for destructive, cleaning, or monkey liquifying purposes. It could arguably be the "final tier" acid, that requires a bit more nuance to get the mix right or it will blow up in your face (along with your face).
- To the trained traitor chemist, (that doesn't let the mix blow up in their face) a perfect compound to reduce a corpse to a messy, but untraceable puddle of carbon. Or a potential deadly mix for a chembomb!
- It's a very cool and well known chemical experiment that fits with the aesthetic of SS13.
EDIT: upon further inspection, it is in fact NOT an acid, but an oxidizer, which in chemistry means it interacts with electrons differently... main take away is that it's the reason why it causes a violent exothermic reaction.
---
Let me know what you think everyone!
here's some youtube vids to show the power of piranha solution:
Mythbusters breaking bad bathtub myth
Periodic videos banana in solution
Nilered making piranha solution
the IRL mix ratio is usually: a 3:1 mixture of sulfuric acid and 30% hydrogen peroxide. And notably, the H2O2 must be added second and at not a too high amount or the mixture will become unstable and bubble out of the beaker or explode.
I'll just add this here from wikipedia:
- Piranha solution must be prepared with great care. It is highly corrosive and an extremely powerful oxidizer. Surfaces must be reasonably clean and completely free of organic solvents from previous washing steps before coming into contact with the solution. Piranha solution cleans by decomposing organic contaminants, and a large amount of contaminant will cause violent bubbling and a release of gas that can cause an explosion.[4]
- Piranha solution should always be prepared by adding hydrogen peroxide to sulfuric acid slowly, never in reverse order.[5][6] This minimises the concentration of hydrogen peroxide during the mixing process, helping to reduce instantaneous heat generation and explosion risk. Mixing the solution is an extremely exothermic process. If the solution is made rapidly, it will instantly boil, releasing large amounts of corrosive fumes. Even when made with care, the resulting heat can easily bring the solution temperature above 100 °C. It must be allowed to cool reasonably before it is used. A sudden increase in temperature can also lead to a violent boiling of the extremely acidic solution. Solutions made using hydrogen peroxide at concentrations greater than 50 wt % may cause an explosion.[7] The 1:1 acid–peroxide mixtures will also create an explosion risk even when using common 30 wt. % hydrogen peroxide.[8]
currently hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) doesn't exist in the game.... or does it?
Space cleaner is essentially H2O2, but perhaps for a recipe that has potentially explosive and highly corrosive outcomes needs to be a bit more balanced!
Upon some research, H2O2 in it's consumer form is essentially space cleaner, however, for a highly concentrated version that would be used in Piranha Solution, it would need to be something closer to High-Test Peroxide a chemical itself that is intensely powerful and used as a propellant in modern rocketry. The concentration of this chem would serve as the main balance for creating Piranha Solution, and therefore should arguably take 10 minutes for someone (who knows what they're doing) to synthesize about 200u.
- Additional info from Wikipedia about High-Test Peroxide:
- Hydrogen peroxide works best as a propellant in extremely high concentrations (roughly over 70%). Although any concentration of peroxide will generate some hot gas (oxygen plus some steam), at concentrations above approximately 67%, the heat of decomposing hydrogen peroxide becomes large enough to completely vaporize all the liquid at standard pressure. This represents a safety and utilization turning point, since decomposition of any concentration above this amount is capable of transforming the liquid entirely to heated gas (the higher the concentration, the hotter the resulting gas). This very hot steam/oxygen mixture can then be used to generate maximal thrust, power, or work, but it also makes explosive decomposition of the material far more hazardous.
- Contact with skin causes immediate whitening due to the production of oxygen below the skin. Extensive burns occur unless washed off in seconds. Contact with eyes can cause blindness, and so eye protection is usually used.
SO, how does one concentrate H2O2? (space cleaner)
One way funnily enough it's by adding sulfuric acid, which creates Piranha Solution, but, when both are put in a sealed container in separate beakers with phosphorus pentoxide, after some time (IRL days-weeks) it concentrates it! (it's a lot more convoluted than this, but this is a game, not a chemistry lesson.)
In game, we could see this as a recipe of: space cleaner (H2O2 unconcentrated) + sulfuric acid + a phosphorus based chem that acts as a desiccant, so either smoke powder or Photophosphide (smoke powder makes more sense, but both have their dangers if exposed to their ignition source). + a stabilizer + The final most important ingredient, TIME.
TLDR recipe for High Test Peroxide (HTP): space cleaner + sulfuric acid + smoke powder + stabilizing agent + time (in a beaker with a lid).
What this process would do is slowly concentrate the space cleaner into HTP, which then (so as not to instantly remove the HTP) would slowly mix with the sulphuric acid to create Piranha Solution. At this point though, as the amount of Piranha solution is created, the hotter the beaker should be getting, causing the smoke powder to ignite if exposed to the air. Another issue is that at a certain temperature, sulphuric acid will break and shatter the beaker! This is where things get a little messy around the dangers of synthesising it, so let's just say if there's an over abundance of HTP to sulphuric acid ratio, causing heat... BOOM!
This synthesis is a bit silly, so perhaps the existence of a stabilizing agent stops the sulphuric acid and HTP from mixing right away, but will slowly deplete as more HTP is synthesised, meaning you would need to continually top it up to avoid explosion.
Another potential recipe is the distillation of the space cleaner in a vacuum under heat.
This would be a much simpler recipe= space cleaner + stabilizing agent + heat ~50-60C + Time in a closed beaker = separating the space cleaner into water and a minimal amount of HTP over some time.
This is much less dangerous without the presence of smoke powder or sulphuric acid, but it makes a bit more sense.
One property that should be present in HTP is that if left in a sealed container, the build-up of oxygen gas will eventually also cause a BOOM! This forces a chemist who is synthesising it to constantly be working to move the HTP out of the distillation or desiccation process mix as both methods would eventually explode with a sealed lid.
For more on H2O2 see these vids:
Explosions and Fire Hydrogen Peroxide
Improper Footwear with High Test Peroxide (essentially real life Phlogiston!)
Back to Piranha Solution:
The major reaction upon applying the solution to organic matter (flesh, clothes, anything made of carbon) should be after a cycle or two, the release of water vapor, CO2 and Hydrogen gas, the intense heat generated by the reaction, and finally the conversion of all organic matter into carbon liquid, bones and all. As the solution is used up, it is replaced with the liquid carbon from the organic source until there is nothing left but carbon and sulphur (the sulphuric acid reducing back into it's elemental form).
When mixed incorrectly, depending on the concentration of H2O2, there would be a small 1x1 to 3x3 explosion that would additionally spray the solution as a liquid around, best you or your friends aren't around when this happens!
On TOUCH I would imagine quite a bit of BURN damage, on higher concentration it may even melt arms and legs (or skin!), causing BRUTE damage.
On INGEST I would imagine similar or worse BURN damage with the addition of melting your organs like your stomach which would then need to be replaced. (not sure why you would drink this but to each their own).
Bathing in it would result in a total liquification of your body after some time, but you will probably be dead from BURN damage before this happens.
With these properties I realise it can be absolutely over powered, but I believe the danger in mixing the solution, and the time spent concentrating the H2O2 to High-Test Peroxide makes up for it.
Why should this be added?
- It gives chemistry a fun new (unstable!) chemical that has various uses for destructive, cleaning, or monkey liquifying purposes. It could arguably be the "final tier" acid, that requires a bit more nuance to get the mix right or it will blow up in your face (along with your face).
- To the trained traitor chemist, (that doesn't let the mix blow up in their face) a perfect compound to reduce a corpse to a messy, but untraceable puddle of carbon. Or a potential deadly mix for a chembomb!
- It's a very cool and well known chemical experiment that fits with the aesthetic of SS13.
EDIT: upon further inspection, it is in fact NOT an acid, but an oxidizer, which in chemistry means it interacts with electrons differently... main take away is that it's the reason why it causes a violent exothermic reaction.
---
Let me know what you think everyone!
here's some youtube vids to show the power of piranha solution:
Mythbusters breaking bad bathtub myth
Periodic videos banana in solution
Nilered making piranha solution
