[CLOSED PR] Removes numbers from health scanners on RP

[Lord_earthfire]

Personally, i am kinda against it if the number functionality gets removed completely and not be given an alternative. So upgrade module giving the exact numbers would be good to have there.

And at that point the change could be implemented in classic as well. Don't think that needs to be RP only.

[Kotlol]

Everytime a topic on changing things for doctors so there is MORE RP for them or MORE IMMERSIONS.
Ends up being a QoL decreasse for them.

And I'll be honest... It's tiring.

I know doctors on Classic and RP basicly feel underappriciated. In classic most players will steal menders or do things themselves and mostly get blown up when an antagonist goes for medbay.
On RP they just heal/clone people then that player rushes off... Their interaction is minimal.

But by making their job harder and harder and longer and argious... you just make people even LESS willing to play it.

This scanner thing is minor and it's outcome is litterly just flavor text. I will still use a mender to get em to full.. inject whatever... and watch those words turn to none.

And what will players say? "Heal my -damage-" Infact I am surprised to say... ALMOST NO ONE ON THE SHIFTS I PLAY SAY: "I got 57% toxin damage"
They say.. "I just got some tox damage." Or... "Tox, get the charcoal"

We cannot punish lack of RP or Bad RP, by making the mechanics of the job harder to force certain interactions.

And if we put in mechanics that force people into interacting with medbay, it ruins other RPs that people want to do.
Imagine a DJ having fun doing their show, but then they get a disease and have to sit out most of their shift in medbay till it's cured?
It would ruin the DJ's expirence and anyone who was enjoying the show... (Then again we could make a "mobile" DJ station to fix that)

But what would we "COULD" do is make it an option to stay in medbay longer and interact.
Traits like Allergies help people to stay in medbay longer and the doctors have to puzzle going around the allergic person's allergies to treat em.
If we simply add more traits that forces players into going to medbay by their OWN VIOLATION. You get a more fun medbay.

I'll write an own suggestion for that.

[Lord_earthfire]

Ends up being a QoL decreasse for them..

The way i would like to see it, its not less QOL for doctors, but a nerf for tiders or people using non-upgraded scaners.

Doctors always use the upgraded tools, since they have the modules avaible in their department. Like it should be.

I don't see why the rest of the crew should have that quality, though.

[Cal]

Yeah after some thought I'm not really down for this. I dunno, it would be unnecessarily difficult for newbies and encourage mendering until it stops

[Kubius]

Bringing this in here from elsewhere:

I think one possible way to explain it is "54% healthy" means an assessment of the odds your condition will deteriorate on its own if unattended, with 0% (crit) being "you Will Not recover unless action is taken".

The health numbers are an abstraction of more detailed physiological damage, and it makes sense that something capable of analyzing that physiological damage would provide you with sufficient detail of that abstraction.

I have an alternate idea to try and achieve the goal I think this is going for: Require medical training to interpret the results of an analyzer scan at full precision (barring cyborgs). IMO, this would more properly work into that abstraction - a medically trained eye would be able to pick things out on scans that a layman couldn't, but anyone can see "leg broken" or "skin seared off".

[Zamujasa]

I have an alternate idea to try and achieve the goal I think this is going for: Require medical training to interpret the results of an analyzer scan at full precision (barring cyborgs). IMO, this would more properly work into that abstraction - a medically trained eye would be able to pick things out on scans that a layman couldn't, but anyone can see "leg broken" or "skin seared off".

this has the same problems described below where this locks "being able to do a job competently" behind being a round-start version of that job and just, no.

Ends up being a QoL decreasse for them..

The way i would like to see it, its not less QOL for doctors, but a nerf for tiders or people using non-upgraded scaners.

Doctors always use the upgraded tools, since they have the modules avaible in their department. Like it should be.

I don't see why the rest of the crew should have that quality, though.

first, doctors don't always have upgraded tools. round-start ones do, sure, but consider a lower pop round where some people join as assistants and go to the hop or captain for a job change; they are already at a disadvantage because of the lack of the round-start medical training trait, this would just make it even harder

if you want to pull someone in who isn't a doctor main, now you have to spend 10 minutes finding and upgrading all of their tools to be actually useful, while making the basic ones useless


like, to be clear here, you can basically divine all of the health information of the obfuscated scanner by interacting with the patient in various ways


1. examine them. this will immediately tell you if they have more than 5 or 30 brute/burn damage ("looks burnt" / "looks severely injured")

2. if they're in crit, clicking on them with a free hand will immediately tell you if they are in crit (attempting CPR)

3. environmental checks, like if the patient has internals on that may have run out, which you need to strip off to do CPR anyway

the only damage type you can't really divine this way is tox, but at the same time if they have no brute or burn, no obvious reason for suffocation, then you have a pretty likely guess





honestly this post pretty much summarizes every possible thought i could have on the subject

this has a whole tizzy of balance and QoL implications for what is essentially "people are making health callouts in a way that is not fitting for the level of RP some people like"

[sunkiisu]

I've already responded to this, but I am glad a lot of the sentiments i didn't manage to fit into my own response are being echoed in other replies. The only other thing I would suggest is that since this seems to be more of a problem with a general issue (which is minor really, but if its important to this extent,) that the best way to encourage more engagement with RP is probably to just lead by example.

When I first started playing I barely, if at all, got invested into rp, whether it be because I didn't feel comfortable, I was nervous, or the fact that I just had no idea what could be done mechanically and what was just flavor (As someone completely unfamiliar with SS13, it is a LOT to take in at first glance.) And this is accounting for the fact that I've been in rp'ing communities for over a decade now. But consistently it has always been other players who have pushed me to do more when it comes to in game rp just by doing it themselves and being inclusive towards others. 

If we want to encourage more in-depth engagement, why not try hosting some kind of improv workshop? Give people the tools for more flavor, and if they want it it's there. If they don't, then they don't and that's alright!

(On a side tangent, I don't think more nonnumerical text on scanners is a terrible thing. I would actually love some changes here and there, like "minimal lacerations" or something if someone's been stabbed. My go-to nonnumerical term for brute is "bruising," but if someone's been cut and is no longer bleeding, I would have no idea if they didn't tell me. Also, making some things like missing organs or brain damage more visible would be great for people who are thrown in the deep end of medbay with no experience, even if it's just placing a small icon under or above the damage on the overhead scan so it's not completely obfuscated by the chat.)

[Lord_earthfire]

if you want to pull someone in who isn't a doctor main, now you have to spend 10 minutes finding and upgrading all of their tools to be actually useful, while making the basic ones useless

Every nanomed plus sells like 10 upgrade modules in total, though. If you got the access, you normally have access to the stuff. I find it more problematic for non-doctors becoming doctors in medbay to get a defib or menders, since these are actually limited.

[Cal]

I would prefer more visual tells for someone needing medical attention that doesn't require examining.

https://forum.ss13.co/showthread.php?tid=18542

Like in this old thread I posted that ended up very off topic