Nerf disarm

[unfunnyperson]

The funny yellow hand is stupidly powerful. You can win a fight against  anyone with a better weapon by selecting disarm and clicking on your opponent. For a weapon to actually be disarmed I suggest that they have to be on very low stamina so you can’t get lucky by clicking one on an opponent.

[UrsulaMejor]

Using weapons consumes stamina. Being on low stamina makes you likely to be disarmed. Hope this helps.

[Katzen]

Been checking out the code, you get both a chance to shove to ground and a chance to disarm in every attack. Disarm does also not take stamina into account.

Shove to ground is:

var/stampart = round( ((STAMINA_MAX - target_stamina) / 3) )
...
if (prob((stampart + 5) * mult))

This gives a 5% chance to ground at full stamina and 38% chance at half stamina.
Chance to disarm their item is a fixed 37% unless sims mode is on.

This means if someone with 200 stamina has used 50 through sprinting/combat you both get a 21% chance to knockdown every shove as well as a fixed 37% chance to disarm. Ouch.

I suggest only rolling once using the stamina scaling style and then picking from either disarm or the knockdown.

[zjdtmkhzt]

I think it is fine as is with the current chance to disarm/knockdown. This is a primary way for the crew to fight back, especially against nukies and stuff, if there is too little chance to actually win for the crew, it'll just be unfun.

[NOOT]

my main issue with disarm is that theres often delay on lifeloop during, for example, heavy nukie fights, where a crewman who has been shot several times and would be in crit when lifeloop resumes, can stll get off multiple shoves on the man shooting him, even though he should be grounded and in crit. If enough walking corpses shove you eventually one will get lucky and be able to get rid of your weapon.

[RichardGere]

my main issue with disarm is that theres often delay on lifelooop during, for example, heavy nukie fights, where a crewman who has been shot several times and would be in crit when lifeloop resumes, can stll get off multiple shoves on the man shooting him, even though he should be grounded and in crit. If enough walkign corpses shove you eventually one will get lucky and be able to get rid of your weapon.

Yeah, this has been an issue for years. Would be nice if it was looked at.

[Reginald_CZ]

From my experiences, disarm more looks like RNG thing. As one time for example an eye monster shoved me many times and nothing happened then I shoved it I think three times and I instantly knocked it down.

And for fighting against somebody with an weapon... First don´t get clicked. Second, I see it fine as it´s otherwise unfair when somebody with a weapon attacks somebody without one. Especially in a fight with nukie.

[Lady Birb]

rng=bad game design
1/3 chance to lose a fight instantly every time someone clicks you on intent 2=very bad game design

[UrsulaMejor]

my main issue with disarm is that theres often delay on lifelooop during, for example, heavy nukie fights, where a crewman who has been shot several times and would be in crit when lifeloop resumes, can stll get off multiple shoves on the man shooting him, even though he should be grounded and in crit. If enough walkign corpses shove you eventually one will get lucky and be able to get rid of your weapon.

this is a super valid take, but I think the problem here isn't with disarm, it's the fact that the walking corpse is even able to try.

mbc suggested that someone should look into forcing a status update when you cross the crit threshold

[Reginald_CZ]

rng=bad game design
1/3 chance to lose a fight instantly every time someone clicks you on intent 2=very bad game design

It´s also based on the stamina. But I wonder what of these two things is more considered. Also both players loose their stamina if they attack or I think shove.

EDIT: Maybe generally disarm could also consider player´s health instead of just stamina?

[cyberTripping]

rng=bad game design
1/3 chance to lose a fight instantly every time someone clicks you on intent 2=very bad game design

It´s also based on the stamina. But I wonder what of these two things is more considered. Also both players loose their stamina if they attack or I think shove.

EDIT: Maybe generally disarm could also consider player´s health instead of just stamina?

Maybe I'm mistaken, but doesn't katzen's analysis of the code earlier explicitly say that chance to disarm is not based on stamina, only the chance to knock someone over?

[Mouse]

Yes let's make it flat out impossible to fight back against people with c-sabers that's a great idea.

[McDougie]

why not have the attackers stamina factor into a disarm attempt? your stamina is ruined in crit so it solves that

[UrsulaMejor]

Maybe I'm mistaken, but doesn't katzen's analysis of the code earlier explicitly say that chance to disarm is not based on stamina, only the chance to knock someone over?

knocking them over also disarms them, since you drop things when that happens

[cyberTripping]

Maybe I'm mistaken, but doesn't katzen's analysis of the code earlier explicitly say that chance to disarm is not based on stamina, only the chance to knock someone over?

knocking them over also disarms them, since you drop things when that happens

I know that. My point is that the fixed 1/3 standard disarm chance isn't scaled off of stamina like knockdown is, so bringing up the fact that knockdown is scaled isn't really a counter to birb's argument. A mere disarm isn't total game over like a knockdown likely is though, so there's that to be considered, but whatever. Rng bad