+- Goonstation Forums (https://forum.ss13.co)
+-- Forum: Discussion (https://forum.ss13.co/forumdisplay.php?fid=6)
+--- Forum: Ideas & Suggestions (https://forum.ss13.co/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+---- Forum: Good ideas! (https://forum.ss13.co/forumdisplay.php?fid=19)
+---- Thread: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants (/showthread.php?tid=4354)
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - Paineframe - 03-13-2015
Mindslave implants are super unstealthy. Implanting someone displays a message to nearby people, the victim falls down when implanted just so there's no doubt about who's responsible, you have to give verbal orders to the mindslave or find some other way to communicate your intent without seeming suspicious, and digging an implant out if a corpse is a super obvious activity that requires a table. Basically every single stage of this process can only be done on a person who is alone, with no one in sight or earshot, and it requires you to steal a scalpel, set up a table, and lead every victim to the same place for murdering.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - Spy_Guy - 03-13-2015
Let it be said that mindslaves shouldn't be wily. While the AI gets to follow the letter of a command or law, mindslaves are expected to follow the spirit of them.
The bullet aspect is interesting. A scenario where the implant's reusability is reduced would mean you'd be out of luck if the mindslave is shot.
Would limiting it on suicides help the issue, though? Imagine a traitor with a mindslave implant and a Russian revolver.
How about making it stop working on death in general? If you want to reuse the implant you have to remove it from your living mindslave.
How's that sound?
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - DyssalC - 03-13-2015
Spy_Guy Wrote:Let it be said that mindslaves shouldn't be wily. While the AI gets to follow the letter of a command or law, mindslaves are expected to follow the spirit of them.That sounds good, the thing about them breaking upon death.
The bullet aspect is interesting. A scenario where the implant's reusability is reduced would mean you'd be out of luck if the mindslave is shot.
Would limiting it on suicides help the issue, though? Imagine a traitor with a mindslave implant and a Russian revolver.
How about making it stop working on death in general? If you want to reuse the implant you have to remove it from your living mindslave.
How's that sound?
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - BaneOfGiygas - 03-13-2015
DyssalC Wrote:Agreed. This also prevents you from wasting an implant on a braindead person, which is a nice plus.Spy_Guy Wrote:Let it be said that mindslaves shouldn't be wily. While the AI gets to follow the letter of a command or law, mindslaves are expected to follow the spirit of them.That sounds good, the thing about them breaking upon death.
The bullet aspect is interesting. A scenario where the implant's reusability is reduced would mean you'd be out of luck if the mindslave is shot.
Would limiting it on suicides help the issue, though? Imagine a traitor with a mindslave implant and a Russian revolver.
How about making it stop working on death in general? If you want to reuse the implant you have to remove it from your living mindslave.
How's that sound?
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - Broodlines - 03-13-2015
imo ordering somebody to suicide as a mindslave is unfun and lazy, (unless the suicide involves some kinda well planned suicide attack on others) Also I'll back up anybody who loopholes or delays a suicide order.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - BaneOfGiygas - 03-13-2015
Broodlines Wrote:imo ordering somebody to suicide as a mindslave is unfun and lazy, (unless the suicide involves some kinda well planned suicide attack on others) Also I'll back up anybody who loopholes or delays a suicide order.Since this is usually performed by those weird traitors who actually try to accomplish their objectives, I find that mindslavers typically don't care how you die as long as you end up dead somehow. To this end, I almost always suggest that I take out a chunk of the station and/or crew with me.
If you're going to mindslave someone to kill themselves, at the very least make some fun out of it.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - Grayshift - 03-13-2015
Allowing it to be dug out in crit state permits the antag to order suicide but don't succumb. Even once it's dug out, I think the breath hold suicide has you gasping instantly so you can't scream for help or an identity. Healthy extraction only (alive and not in crit) sounds like the best plan I've heard to close any loopholes about using one implant to kill multiple people.
Having it break on suicide does force the traitor to put their victim into crit in a noisier fashion, but doesn't really solve the problem of crit-extractions.
Fun mindslave story: Bought three mindslave implants and skulked off to the russian shuttle to make 900u of black powder. Gave my slaves 300u each in pills, told them to eat 'em, find someone they don't like and continuously whack themselves with a welder next to them.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - APARTHEID - 03-13-2015
With your last dying breath, let your master know how much of an unfun rule-lawyering Stalin they are as you suicide and succumb.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - Ed Venture - 03-13-2015
I don't really see it as that big of a issue. Sure it's a real dick move but players in space station have a notorious reputation of being assholes. If you really need a "fix" for it just make it so implant can't be reused.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - UrsulaMejor - 03-13-2015
I think the viability of this strategy is kind of limited in how terribly obvious it is. it's nowhere near as stealthy as other items, and to be frank, it's bloody obvious when someone drags a corpse into medbay and digs out the same implant over and over.
making it not reusable would be an okay nerf, but ordering your mindslave to commit suicide should always be a viable, if not very creative, option.
it's natural to get mad when this happens to you, but being mad does not mean the item is unbalanced.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - BaneOfGiygas - 03-13-2015
UrsulaMejor Wrote:making it not reusable would be an okay nerf, but ordering your mindslave to commit suicide should always be a viable, if not very creative, option.I wholeheartedly agree. I think that the problem is less about how dull of a strategy it is and more about how ludicrously effective it is to the point of being borderline silly.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - DyssalC - 03-13-2015
UrsulaMejor Wrote:I think the viability of this strategy is kind of limited in how terribly obvious it is. it's nowhere near as stealthy as other items, and to be frank, it's bloody obvious when someone drags a corpse into medbay and digs out the same implant over and over.It's overpowered when reusable and used in the fashion we're discussing, the reasons have already been listed.
making it not reusable would be an okay nerf, but ordering your mindslave to commit suicide should always be a viable, if not very creative, option.
it's natural to get mad when this happens to you, but being mad does not mean the item is unbalanced.
When not reusable it's not overpowered. Very simple.
Also, it's natural to get mad because it's boring. It's really god damn boring. It's not even an issue of death, it's just that getting mindslaved and being told to suicide and succumb is the most boring, play-to-win thing. Mindslave somebody and tell them to blow themselves up in a crowded area? No issue. But this is just cheap, boring, uncreative, and uneventful, and above-all unfun. And I get fun is subjective, but I can only see this being fun if you're super inittowinit.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - TheOnlyRyan - 03-13-2015
Ursula, he wasn't dragging them I to messy.
He carried a table around with him so he could just plonk them down on it after they succumbed, cut it out and hide them in a closet.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - TheOnlyRyan - 03-13-2015
Into medbay*
God damn iphone.
Re: Round Killing Mind Slave Implants - Dauntasa - 03-13-2015
Spy_Guy Wrote:How about making it stop working on death in general? If you want to reuse the implant you have to remove it from your living mindslave.if it's genuinely such a huge problem just make it act as a microbomb on death