Security set-up proposal *with pictures!!*

[Sundance]

Alright, so I think the best idea instead of throwing around ideas for security is to actually put up some blueprints on what needs to be done. Here is the current security set-up, not-to-scale-but-still-understandable:

Here's my revised version:

-->Removed the sec maintenance and parts of the crew quarters, essentially the snip's (oh no, anything but that!), extended the hallway to the right of the detectives up a bit. The snip will need some work, but because some of the maint is removed, it can be moved a few tiles up a bit.
-->Replaced area with high security parole room, where prisoners items are held in timed lockers similar to mushroom. Can be accessed by security and the detective (if he wants to rummage for some evidence). Prisoners can exit room via pressing a button to open door.
-->Prisoners are put in parole room via floor flusher.
-->Added double reinforced glass to the other side of general pop, so now prisoners can now get help breaking out.
-->Added IR beam (in purple) and lockdown button (in yellow) for general pop and sec hq. Sure you can bust people out of general pop easier now, but there'll be an alarm, and a big metal shutters to added into the pot which = more fun if there's competent jailbreakers.
-->Lockdown extends all around bar one place, the exit at parole. This is to stop overflowing into sec if it is compromised but also to prevent shit sec immediately locking down general pop. once round starts.

..So what you guys think?
Not all these ideas needs to be implemented, but this is really to tackle the issues at hand. Of course I can revise this again if needs be.

[Captain_Bravo]

How is the floor flusher going to work? The entire reason nobody has instituted a floor flusher is because gen pop now just has everyone hanging out in the same room. There's no way to make a floor flusher only get one person, and sure as hell no way for sec to convince the rest of gen pop to move out of the way and just let the guy getting paroled be flushed to freedom.

Instead of eliminating maintenance, just add a maintenance door to the east of the detective's office, effectively just extending west crew quarter's maintenance and linking all that up. I would suggest that anyway, since the only way to access crew quarter's west maintenance is by running through crew quarters itself, and I'm not a fan of that design.

I don't know if we have it in our files, but would it be possible to put in a stationary, button-activated floor flasher? Stick it dead center of Genpop, and whenever Sec needs to get in they can just fire it off to flash the whole room and move in to do what needs to be done. For bonus points, make it so it doesn't affect anyone in the bathroom, and give it wiring under the floor, for possible shenanigans involving inattentive guards and clever prisoners.

One thing you didn't suggest here, and that I really would, is putting a window in the bathroom that looks out into space. Gives prisoners an actual, dangerous escape option, and penalizes security that just throw prisoners into the brig without checking bags or taking their equipment. (As I usually do )

Actually, screw it. I've got MsPaint too. Let me show you:



Floor-mounted device for restraining inmates, which can be disabled with tools, avoided by hiding in the bathroom, or scanned by traitor electrician analyzer for hijinks. Added window in the bathroom which looks out onto a new airlock added near crew quarter's west maintenance, just far enough away that heading out without O2 or a suit is almost certainly a death sentence. Also, the gap needs to be at least 2x2 the whole way down, allowing for daring pod-based escape plans. New maintenance door added north of the detective's office, allowing easier access to maintenance.

[Captain_Bravo]

Oh, hey, guess what. I'm an idiot who replied without checking other stuff, and there's already a new Sec layout! Huzzah!

[Sundance]

What were the changes made? I haven't been on, and the wiki said that there's no more solitary cell, which is great, but doesn't resolve all the issues at hand.

How is the floor flusher going to work?

The floor flusher can work in numerous ways, all involving an ID and one of those glass doors.
The prisoner can be logged into the jail through the Securitron 3000 if there was a timer variable on it.
Once the time is up, he can swipe his ID on the glass door which would open, allowing one person into it, then close. Then the floor flusher would activate, bringing him to the parole room. No need
If there's no securitron 3000 implemented, then you could do it on the SecMate computer.
Of course, you can always steal another inmates ID and escape sooner, I personally like that aspect.

The reason I wanted the general pop. window on the right-hand side was for prisoners to escape easier. Exposing the right-hand side to space is a bad idea, can't you see why? Jailbreaking means depressurizing which in turn means suffocation. Don't let some bad dude trying to bust out a prisoner piss on someone who is actually serving their time.

I don't like the floor flasher. That's just asking for some sadistic sec officer to keep pressing it just because a prisoner is bad mouthing someone. And this does happen. Try the other servers.
The lockdown is enough security imo. Tripwire activates, alarm goes off either alerting the ai or alerting your pda, nearest person has to run and go press the lockdown button, lots of fun.

[Captain_Bravo]

I agree that depressurizing the entire genpop for an escape is a bad idea, that's why I suggested putting the window in the bathroom.

[Captain_Bravo]

And, I was talking about this, which I noticed after reading and responding to this topic.

The crackdown is proceeding, a few bans have gone out and the brig has been redesigned. Lots of good comments here, lets keep this thread civil and figure out what needs to happen to make security something people might want to play once in a while.

[Sundance]

I agree that depressurizing the entire genpop for an escape is a bad idea, that's why I suggested putting the window in the bathroom.

http://autisticpowers.info/ss13/wiki/ima...abeled.jpg
Check the map. Are you saying to remove all the maint to the right-hand side to allow space at the window at the toilet? That would mean that there's still going to be space to the right of general pop, which would only be encouraging people to bust out there instead of the toilet, even if they were to just smack it with glass shards.

[Captain_Bravo]

No, I'm suggesting we add a window to the bathroom, and an airlock further down the ways. As it stands, the only way back inside the station are through a bolted airlock, which requires tools to open. Put an airlock on the west side of the observatory, so enterprising felons can try making a run for it, and die gasping in space if they don't make it.

[Cogwerks]

The weak point of the bathroom is that it's already pretty easy to dismantle the walls and escape into maintenance. Solitary has been changed to be a floor-flusher timer cell instead.
Mounted flashes were absolutely godawful when we had them.

[Sundance]

Ok I've done alot with this new pic. I've basically photoshopped it (cropped rather crudely) to look like what I've suggested and what others have suggested and tried in the Security crackdown thread.
Here's the link for the pic:
http://i.imgur.com/c6G5kvB.jpg
And here's the pic resized for forums if you only want a glance.

*Added floor flusher. It's the sliding door beside the harmonica. Screen might have a pop-up window to show what time the player has left, but not necessary really.
*Added Parole room with lockers.
*Added windows and IR beams to the east of the gen pop. Added triple reinforced wall for the solitary if you want to break from the inside, and swapped the computer around with the seat so people can break in from the outside. Because that computer got completely in the way.
*Changed sec entrance around a bit as suggested by Weavel to stop lame campers
*Added sec access door to gen pop as suggested by Dachshundofdoom to prevent prisoners from killing themselves at a risk.
*Changed things around with The snip. Hopefully this new hallway due to footfall, The snip will get better business, due to a small compromise for the back-room.
*Big ass empty space there, will probably need some decorating with vending machines, shrubs, etc.

What'cha think?

[Hard Boiled]

Ok I've done alot with this new pic. I've basically photoshopped it (cropped rather crudely) to look like what I've suggested and what others have suggested and tried in the Security crackdown thread.
Here's the link for the pic:
http://i.imgur.com/c6G5kvB.jpg
And here's the pic resized for forums if you only want a glance.

*Added floor flusher. It's the sliding door beside the harmonica. Screen might have a pop-up window to show what time the player has left, but not necessary really.
*Added Parole room with lockers.
*Added windows and IR beams to the east of the gen pop. Added triple reinforced wall for the solitary if you want to break from the inside, and swapped the computer around with the seat so people can break in from the outside. Because that computer got completely in the way.
*Changed sec entrance around a bit as suggested by Weavel to stop lame campers
*Added sec access door to gen pop as suggested by Dachshundofdoom to prevent prisoners from killing themselves at a risk.
*Changed things around with The snip. Hopefully this new hallway due to footfall, The snip will get better business, due to a small compromise for the back-room.
*Big ass empty space there, will probably need some decorating with vending machines, shrubs, etc.

What'cha think?

This is amazing. It provides a great way for breakouts to still happen, what with the windows and the weak bathroom walls, but at the same time cuts down on people who want to just mess with sec! Nothing here is "Too hard!" because what you want to get is a prisoner, not messing with sec. On the sec side, it's MUCH easier to brig and relese someone when you need to do it alone. As a g4 player, sometimes, I am the HoS with no sec. It's not easy having the AI open the brig doors for me to get out a killer when he could disarm me if I'm not fast enough. With this, you can just either pop a flashbang in for questioning them in the interrogation room or have them stand on the flusher for a quick release. no worries about them coming back to grief you with the added door for sec access. I really like it, and it brings back fond memories on mushrooms brig.

[Sundance]

This is amazing. It provides a great way for breakouts to still happen

Yes, this is what I was trying to do incorporate. I don't want the brig to be high-security-never-see-daylight-again kind of set-up, so that's why I added various weak spots within sec. Like you said, there's the windows, there's the weak toilet walls if you can get into parole, and now you break into solitary provided you have time or a spacesuit.

I know cog's ain't supportive of the timer idea, but even adding a floor flusher using an external button to activate it and enable prisoners to port over to the parole room where their gear is waiting for them can be nothing beneficial right?

[Marquesas]

So, instead of a maintenance tunnel behind the huge cell, you want a lit to oblivion corridor, with glass windows. So that escape is simplified from welder+crowbar/wrench to throwing your cellmate at a window 8 times plus hitting the grille with the resulting shard 20 times.
An IR detector, yes, let's free the officers from all duties by automating the escapee detection process, I don't know, that set of windows seems like a dumb design choice by the worst engineers in the galaxy NT could assemble.
The cell bathroom is now pointless.

Address these issues by extending the maintenance tunnel all the way to the bathroom. Make the bathroom have a single one normal wall that is shared with the tunnel. And then I'm not sure why you'd want windows looking at maintenance tunnels, so remove the windows and the IR altogether. In fact revert the whole thing and come up with a less dumb parole idea. I could completely go for a security-openable chute between the two blast doors that dumps you outside. That way you'd have control over who accesses it and wouldn't have to deal directly with the shitter.

TRIPLE R-WALL for solitary. Not even the AI has that kind of protection. Nobody is that determined to break into a jail cell.

The security door to general population is cool. That should stay.

[Sundance]

So, instead of a maintenance tunnel behind the huge cell, you want a lit to oblivion corridor, with glass windows. So that escape is simplified from welder+crowbar/wrench to throwing your cellmate at a window 8 times plus hitting the grille with the resulting shard 20 times.

Why, yes. Yes I am. And you seem to be implying that people in jail would have a welder,crowbar and wrench? If they do then by all means they should escape due to incompetence.
This new set-up encourages help from the outside, consider that "lit to oblivion corridor" actually a visiting room, maybe it'll look nicer with seats facing the windows so people can act out the trauma of being inside, and doors connecting the lower hallway that'll make is seem less corridory. I did say in my last point that this rather large area needs to be filled, but you ignored that.
You also want me to revert back to the whole thing but you seem to be blatantly ignoring THE EXACT reason I put windows leading to a visiting room in the first place. It's because currently although you can smack the left hand windows you are still stuck within the brig area. Now you can escape to sweet freedom, at the cost of potentially setting off a huge alarm and getting yourself locked in.

Considering your second point though about the IR detector though, I might face the r-windows inside the brig like so, so that security actually have a chance at pushing the lockdown button:

The cell bathroom is not pointless. You can inconspicuously take down the r-wall in the parole room, then you're in the honey. Or out of spite if you out of gen-pop and getting back your tools, you could do it too. Before it was just run to maint and completely fuck up gen-pop by taking out a wall nobody notices.

TRIPLE R-WALL for solitary. Not even the AI has that kind of protection. Nobody is that determined to break into a jail cell.

The triple r-wall has no detector. You can bust in there with time and a cut camera. Previously you had to go through an air-less wreckage to get near there. Also you ignored the fact that now you can escape to space.


Y'know what marquesas, until you actually go off and research what the actual issues with the current brig layout, maybe I'd consider your points a bit more. But from this thread and the other, it really shows that you haven't. Brace yourself, i've underline the points to make it easier for you to understand.
-->The gen-pop is rarely used. Why? Because it is far too finicky and time-consuming
-->You can't break out of gen-pop without getting stuck
-->It is very difficult to get prisoners out
-->Taking prisoners stuff is pretty important as they can use almost anything to smack the window down, but there's no safe place to put their stuff
-->Security has to be constantly watching the brig, hence time consuming
-->If security are all dead or afk, people in gen-pop may be permanently brigged
-->People generally dislike being put in gen-pop because the time is indefinite
-->While the gen-pop would be fun if you had someone with you in the jail to converse with, w/e, this never happens because you are probably the only person in gen-pop or the others are too busy smacking the window

Unless you can actually suggest something that can rectify these, my proposal still stands.

[Marquesas]

I've spent my fair share of time as HoS, and so have you. We apparently experienced our time as HoS very differently. I'm not trying to create problems where there aren't, instead I _adapt_.