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IRC ban (MollyMillions)
Who banned you?:  MollyMillions
Byond Key: wabash
Date of Ban: 6/13/2016? date may be a little off
Specified Reason for Ban: Unspecified
Ban Length: Unknown
What led to the ban? I was in an argument with some snowflake that believes islam doesn't hate people (AND KILL) for their sexual orientation and was banned by MollyMillions who was homophobic and said, 'ur gay'.
"* You have been kicked from #goonstation by MollyMillions (ur gay)"
Why am I appealing? / Why should I be unbanned: This ban was really uncalled for, I didn't start the political argument, I just joined in and took the devil's advocate and was banned for not having the same opinions.
Evasion Attempts: None
I believe Islam is a religion of peace and your belief that it teaches violence is incredibly bigoted and backwards, especially in these times. I do not think you offer anything of value in the IRC if this is all you want to talk about, not that I especially want to have a person that thinks the adherents of a religion are all backwards savages back in.
I wasn't around for any of this, but dang that is a crummy "what led to the ban."
(06-15-2016, 02:40 PM)Huff H Law Wrote: I believe Islam is a religion of peace and your belief that it teaches violence is incredibly bigoted and backwards, especially in these times. I do not think you offer anything of value in the IRC if this is all you want to talk about, not that I especially want to have a person that thinks the adherents of a religion are all backwards savages back in.

You are right, those that were murdered in orlando and those thrown off a building in al-furat for having that orientation were just killed because these people hate homosexuals and not because of their strong to the T following of their religion. A Pope culture icon.
You have been repeatedly warned, kicked, and banned from IRC by myself and others many times over the last few years and have never once shown any sign of improvement. I do not think you contribute anything worthwhile to IRC and that your attitude frequently skews toward bullying and instigating for no real reason. #goonstation doesn't need devil's advocates. If you have a sincerely held political belief, you are entitled to it, but the rules are (and always have been) that bigotry and bullying are against the rules. Bigotry is not magically allowed just because you've decided to stand on it as a political viewpoint rather than casual shittery.

To give the readers out there a little context, a debate about gun control started up in the wake of the Orlando shooting. These kinds of discussions never go over well in #goonstation, and I had to warn a few people and drop a tempban in the last day or two. Cue Wabash, who had been silent up till then -

Quote:<wabash1> you guys want to talk politics? I LOVE POLITICS LETS DO THIS

A few anti-gun statements were made by a user in the chatroom, who was understandably upset that a mass murder had been carried out against their people in the LGBT community.

Quote:<wabash1> Esser-Z you're a fucking retard
<wabash1> those aren't your people
<wabash1> those are people who have the same sexual attraction

Wabash went on to say that just because someone has the same sexual orientation doesn't make them a community. His attitude throughout was hostile, mean-spirited, and not at all meant in the spirit of polite discussion. If this were anyone else, they'd get a warning and at worst a kick or a tempban, but as an admin it's my job to intervene when people are being shitty. Wabash was, as usual, being shitty. No one is surprised by this--he only ever participates in discussions in order to do this exact kind of thing.

Not that I need to say any of this. I think your conduct right here in this thread illustrates well enough what the problem is. We discussed this ban behind the scenes and suffice to say you have not presented any information here that in any way makes me want to reconsider this IRC ban. You are not banned from the game, you are (permanently) banned from the chatroom because you have a habit of continually making it an unpleasant place to be.

Let me be absolutely clear about another thing: "retard" is a slur and we have always considered it to be one. Knock it off with that shit.
Can knock off the retard part but he did not know these people, they had no link to him other than the same orientation, they are not his community. Bunch of straight people dying doesn't make a straight person go MY PEOPLE ARE DYING. These are not your people, they are people, they are human beings certainly and they didn't have to die, but to make it an argument that you are right because you are also gay makes you a fucking idiot. Guns don't kill people but people and their beliefs certainly do!


<cheet> idk when i think of a good presidential canidate, having an ongoing fbi investigation is not one of the qualitys i want
* hukhukhuk slaps cheet around a bit with a large trout
<cheet> eeeeeeee
<cheet> sorry for being reasonable D:
<hukhukhuk> its click warmly time yo
<wabash1> What's this
<Esser-Z>  cheet  it's not ongoing
<wabash1> you guys want to talk politics? I LOVE POLITICS LETS DO THIS
<Esser-Z> they relased their findings
<Esser-Z> I just fucking sai dthat
<wabash1> they have not released the emails
<Esser-Z> well, no, they won't
<wabash1> the state department has to 'sort' the emails
<Esser-Z> because it's technically classified
<wabash1> and it won't be done till MANY YEARS from now
<Esser-Z> the GOP is perfomring a witch hunt
<Esser-Z> for political reasons
<wabash1> It's not a witch hunt
<Esser-Z> dude
<Esser-Z> every. single. secstate. this. millenium
<cheet> the gop is a bunch of literal clowns
<thebobster> Fight! Fight! Fight!
<Esser-Z> has had a private server
<Esser-Z> every one
<thebobster> also sink the gop into the ocean asap
<Esser-Z> it's af ucking witch hungt
<Gulping> because using government email is fucking terrible
<wabash1> It's something that if it was you or I doing we would be in trouble
<cheet> gop should be officially reclassed as a circus
<Esser-Z> wabash1, then why wasn't Rumsfield in trouble? RIce?
<Gulping> using government database searches is fuckin terrible
<Esser-Z> they all did the same damn thing
<Gulping> because they were republicans.
<Esser-Z> But suddenly HIllary did it and it's BADWRONG
<Esser-Z> funny.
<wabash1> Not the issue.
<Esser-Z> it kinda fucking is
<HeadSurgeon> does not scare me
<Esser-Z> They're only doing it because of politics
<wabash1> The issue is the WIPED emails
<Gulping> also government people are bad at email.
<HeadSurgeon> is corrupt politics
<Chase> governement people are bad at computers*
<cheet> a part of me secretly wants trump to win so we can burn it all away and start anew from the ashes
<Chase> these are old people using computers guys
<mollymillions__> that's not how that kind of thing works cheet
<Esser-Z> wabash1, business. as. usual.
<Esser-Z> HIllary Clinton and her staff did nothing everyone else in those jobs hasn't done
<wabash1> Does that make it right?
<mollymillions__> a trump victory would just reinforce the part of the right he represents by stabilizing a reliable base of power
<Esser-Z> wabash1, so...go clamor to investigate them, too
<cheet> but hes the worst leader ever
<cheet> he isnt even good at business
<wabash1> Hillary wants to get rid of the constitutional rights of americans
<mollymillions__> that doesnt actually matter w/r/t how election cycles work
<Chase> any day now...the investigation will come up with something
<thebobster> let's all meet up & vote for gay marriage irl
<Esser-Z> wabash1, whahahahahahahaha
<Chase> they have to come up with something
<Esser-Z> what
<Esser-Z> if yhou mean 2nd amendment
<Esser-Z> good
<Esser-Z> that needs to fucking go
<wabash1> I do mean the second amendment
<thebobster> destroy all guns imho
<wabash1> It does not need to go
<Esser-Z> Okay. Listen
<Esser-Z> I am LGBT
<wabash1> You can't protect the first amendment without the second
<Esser-Z> I just had 50 of my people killed.
<Esser-Z> So kindly
<thebobster> I think we're all gay here
<Esser-Z> Fuck off
<cheet> im also lgbt
<thebobster> I wasn't joking around
<mollymillions__> aight simmer down class
<wabash1> Esser-Z you're a fucking retard
<cheet> but i like the 2nd amendment
<wabash1> those aren't your people
<Esser-Z> AUstralia got rid of guns
<Butthomlod> 'my people'
<Esser-Z> has had no more mass shootings
<Esser-Z> funny
<wabash1> those are people who have the same sexual attraction
<Esser-Z> ......
<Esser-Z> ...
* Esser-Z ([email protected]) has left (Leaving)
<Butthomlod> Oh good
<cheet> rip
<thebobster> Who was that guy anyway?
<Butthomlod> Hello everyone
<Butthomlod> :)
* Esser-Z ([email protected]) has joined
* ChanServ gives voice to Esser-Z
<Esser-Z> listen
<wabash1> The peaceful islamist?
<Esser-Z> ther eis a goddamn community.
<Butthomlod> Awww
<Esser-Z> FUck. You.
<Esser-Z> wabash1, if you mean the shooter
<hukhukhuk> ok if this gets shitty ima do things
<Chase> it's okay wabash
<Chase> a room of dead children wasn't enough
<Esser-Z> the guy whose family said HE'S NOT VEYR RELIGIOUS????
<Chase> nothing will happen
* MollyMillions ([email protected]) has joined
<wabash1> The peaceful religious guy
* ChanServ gives channel operator status to MollyMillions
* Sartorius has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC)
<Butthomlod> *fart
<Butthomlod> (   )  )
<wabash1> The same guy whose family hates america? :)
<Esser-Z> his fucking father. said. he's. not. very. religous. but. is. very. homphobic
<Esser-Z> fuck you
* MollyMillions sets ban on *[email protected]
* You have been kicked from #goonstation by MollyMillions (ur gay)
All right since you're just trying to carry on the argument after being told not to I'm going to lock this thread. This incident in and of itself wouldn't warrant an IRC ban, but your general history and complete lack of understanding about what's wrong with your behavior along with this crummy appeal are working against you here.

Seriously, you even used the rainbow icon. Fuck off.
Oh god, are we really doing this again? This is a horrible ban.

I'm not going to paste the entire argument I just had in admin chats but 

i don't think any of us should be in the business of deciding who is and is not shitty
and enforcing the correct behavior from people talking about things in an irc room
<drsingh> we should ban people who are there interfering to protect the people who are part of the community
<drsingh> he's an asshole but he's a community member
<drsingh> thats basically my position in a nutshell, s o r r y

re: i don't think any of us should be in the business of deciding who is and is not shitty
<mollymillions__> that's literally 100% of my job as an admin
<drsingh> look
<drsingh> deciding who is and is not shitty in game, ok i'm with you 100%

This pretty much summarizes how I feel about this, I can't support this ban.
i think continually choosing the rainbow icon for your posts in this thread is a bad thing
I happen to know Esser-Z most certainly does fit into the groups they claim to fit into, and has caught shit for it both online and off. Goonstation is not the nicest venue to begin with but turning it into yet another toxic shit-zone is just sad.
drsingh we had a big conversation about that stuff in IRC, I'll get you the logs

Most Muslims aren't psychotic homophobes. In fact, the majority of Muslims range between 'who gives a crap how two people choose to get down' and 'look i think it's heck of grody and church says it ain't cool but w/e their problem not mine'. The extremists who attack people over it are a minority - granted, an extremely LOUD one, but. Claiming that it's a religion of hate and homophobic by nature is like claiming that all Christians are homophobic dickheads who hate women because you can find a few lines in Leviticus.

There's a fine line between 'okay to say in #goonstation' and 'not okay to say in #goonstation'. If you're making statements about your own ideas and opinions, that's fine. If you're saying so-and-so is a rotten person because they hold a Wrong Opinion, or they're a naive dipshit because LOOK EVERYBODY KNOWS THEM THERE MUSLINS ARE EEBUL, or claiming that the LGBT community literally doesn't exist because you don't think it does, then you should probably shut up and go away until you can act and converse like a damn adult.

But even then, there's a judgment call. I wasn't there, so this is conjecture, but I might not have banned you for that. I absolutely would have screamed at you for calling someone a retard, since that is a pretty rotten thing to say to someone in a public forum. I absolutely would have jumped on you for claiming there's no such thing as an LGBT community because you're flatly wrong. Just because you personally do not observe it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I doubt you've been high enough above sea level to personally observe the curvature of the earth; would you claim that the earth is flat? No, because that's dumb and easily disproved.

Look we've known each other and been friends for a while. You and I both know you love few things more than stirring up shit. You went a little far this time. Like I said, I might not have banned you, personally, but if you're claiming this came out of nowhere you're fooling yourself.

As a sidebar, we're discussing the expectations of discourse in IRC as a result of this and a couple other Recent Events.
Alright, time to explain a few things, I never said all muslims were bad, hell most are not, most don't actively want to go out and murder a bunch of dudes in a bar. My argument is that fundamentally most major monotheistic religions are homophobic, to claim that these religions are extremely inclusive in their texts is not true; those within the religion can be, never said they couldn't. That said, in 20 out of 57 majority muslim nations same sex intercourse is not forbidden, it's fine in those and that's a start.

I was wrong in the way I expressed my opinion for esser-z using the cop-out of she/he/they is right because of their sexual orientation, this isn't an argument but an appeal to authority and I responded harshly to this and I really should have not been so rude on it. I never explicitly said there's not an LGBT community, that's not correct at all.

I'm still appealing this ban however unlikely it is, here have a couple spinach pies I have cooked.

[Image: ncBFTrFAsX2XLNChw3a9cYZopRuLwXyhTcFNKDTQ...95-h821-no]

edit: to clarify, thank you for posting a better and more reasonable ban appeal. I will not be revoking this ban but I do appreciate it.
This thread is not to be locked again until and unless the OP does something specifically to warrant it. The end.

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