Speedloaders

[Bologna Prime]

This post serves towards rectifying a problem presented in the recently locked detective thread. This does not concern detective behavior in any way.

I've been in a firefight with a detective, and he speed reloaded 4 fucking times. That's over 21 times he shot his gun. That's not the guns purpose. And it's a gross advantage.

So the detective's speedloaders allow him to shoot folks at tremendous speeds, with all these bullets being fired the victim is likely to die very fast.

It's already been discussed that we could reduce the ammo available to the detective. I propose an alternative fix. Give the detective a single speedloader; and make the rest of the ammo supply come in piles. Each pile is composed of the same amount of ammo as the current speedloaders, but can only load bullets one at a time. The speedloader can be reloaded with these piles, but it wouldn't make sense to do that in combat. With this the detective still has plenty ammo, but actually has to take some time to reload if he blazes through his ammo firing blindly.

[DyssalC]

This is definitely a good alternative, as it keeps the .38 useful even after heavy use, it's just that you actually have to worry about ammo on hand instead of never caring because you have a utility belt full of ammo, two boxes of ammo, both pockets with ammo, and a few more just in your bag.

14 shots for encounters, unless you decide to pocket a few individual rounds. Seems like a good number.

[Grayshift]

A good change, but I'm still of the opinion that the detective should not get better kit than actual security. Tasers only fire six times and can't be combat reloaded. If you want to tase and arrest people or just bust heads, sign up for actual sec. So long as the detective is better at arresting people than the people who are supposed to do that, that's how it will continue.

So, my suggestion from the other thread: Remove ammo from the sec vending machines. Remove stun rounds altogether. Detective starts with seven shots in the gun and one reload, all lethal, because he's a loose cannon like that. It's a panic button, not a hunting criminals tool.

[BaneOfGiygas]

It's a panic button, not a hunting criminals tool.

This pretty much encapsulates what the detective's revolver should be in one near little sentence. If a detective is able to arrest criminals with the same ease as the security officers when he is not designed to be on the same level as a security officer, something should probably be changed.

[Dauntasa]

I think Grayshift is on to something but I'd like to tweak it: The detective should still have stunners, but they shouldn't work the way the ones he has now do.

The ones he has now are basically taser bolts. When loaded with stunners the .38 is essentially a taser(with the trade off of being able to reload in exchange for no burst fire). I'm gonna say that instead of draining someone's stamina and then having them pass out, like tasers do, they should just basically be rubber bullets that knock people over for a little while. You shoot someone with it, they fall down for ~10 seconds and drop their weapon. This gives you time to escape and get backup, which is what the detective should be doing.

[UrsulaMejor]

I like dauntasa's suggestion re: knockdown AND the suggestion to make most of the ammo piles

[Ali0en]

Unfun fact: detective stun rounds do brute damage and tasers don't. He just needs not so much fucking ammo.

I was actually talked to for hitting other people while shooting at a chef charging me with a baton, as can be seen in one of my videos.

[Grayshift]

I just tested that. Detective stun rounds do zero damage, even pointblank.

[Frank_Stein]

So, presumably you'd be able to load up your gun from the ammo pile, one bullet per click. Alternatively you could load the speedloader ahead of time and use that to put as many bullets in at once as are loaded in there.

Sounds good to me.

[babayetu83]

you know i think a better way to deal with this would be so that you actually have to pay for your speedloaders

rather than just emptying all of the sec vending machines for them at no cost

[Ali0en]

The detective now starts with his revolver loaded with stuns (I believe?), and his box full of 2 special and 2 stun loaders. He can get more stun loaders from sec vendors. Point blank shots with specials also don't seem to make people drop anymore.

[Convair880]

Yes, I reduced the number of readily available speedloaders to a more reasonable level yesterday. I can see why traitor detectives didn't have any incentive to order AP ammo.

* Closet: 4 lethal, 5 stun, loaded gun (stun) -> 2 lethal, 2 stun, loaded gun (stun)
* Sec vendor: 4 lethal, 4 stun -> 2 stun

[Dauntasa]

He should have more lethals than stunners, though.

[Paineframe]

I think he should definitely have more stun shots? Stun shot consumption should be higher even if used properly, since you can't permanently neutralize people with them.

[Dauntasa]

The .38 with stunners loaded is a taser. You give him a taser and he's a sec officer with a funny hat.