Hotwired Doors Shouldn’t be Able to Insta-Gib

[Snowy :D]

I don’t have too much to say about his one.

Dealing a hefty amount of burn and maybe blowing off your arms is fine, but instantly gibbing people without warning for doing the simple act of touching a door is a bit too far.

I’ve had rounds where I latejoined without knowing about the hotwire and gibbed within minutes or even seconds after joining due to it.

[Kotlol]

While death by door is hilarious... especially being shocked to death..
I needs a visual indicator.

As it stands now it ends in a lot of CHEAP DEATHS that no one can see coming.

Now let's say there are sparks flying from the door or the door has a "red glow to it"
Yea then it's fine.

But either remove it or give a clear indicator for players to pick up on.

[Snowy :D]

While death by door is hilarious... especially being shocked to death..
I needs a visual indicator.

As it stands now it ends in a lot of CHEAP DEATHS that no one can see coming.

Now let's say there are sparks flying from the door or the door has a "red glow to it"
Yea then it's fine.

But either remove it or give a clear indicator for players to pick up on.

Yeah, I didn’t mention it in my initial post but I’m also fond of the idea of a visual indicator.

[Lord_earthfire]

No, i think its fine.

This needs a) a hotwire, b) a very good working engine and c) to actually shock doors that are directly connected by cables to the hotwire.

If someone makes that happen, they deserve to gib a few people. Sometimes you simply die very quickly and that's just part of the hillariousness of the story we all play on station. "Cheap deaths" are part of it.

[Kotlol]

No, i think its fine.

This needs a) a hotwire, b) a very good working engine and c) to actually shock doors that are directly connected by cables to the hotwire.

If someone makes that happen, they deserve to gib a few people. Sometimes you simply die very quickly and that's just part of the hillariousness of the story we all play on station. "Cheap deaths" are part of it.

A: Happens a lot on accident
B: *insert wrong relic*
C: That's most doors.

As Snowy points out.. they spawned, didn't know of the hotwiring, touched the 1st door and DIED. Just having an indication something that can be shocked is fine. We have that for bolted doors too.

[Snowy :D]

No, i think its fine.

This needs a) a hotwire, b) a very good working engine and c) to actually shock doors that are directly connected by cables to the hotwire.

If someone makes that happen, they deserve to gib a few people. Sometimes you simply die very quickly and that's just part of the hillariousness of the story we all play on station. "Cheap deaths" are part of it.

I’ve heard that a hotwire isn’t too difficult to pull off, although due to my lack of experience making hotwires and the fact that they are a bit uncommon, I can’t say this for certain.

Regardless, hotwires can still do a lot outside of gibbing people. They can electrocute people for touching doors (alongside occasionally sending them flying and causing them to loose an arm), render said doors unusable without insuls, and shock anyone near an APC. I imagine hotwired engines are still worth the effort it takes to make one even without the gibbing. 

While on the topic of cheap deaths, what other kinds of cheap death are there? The only thing that I can think of would be microbomb implants, although those typically require the user to sacrifice themselves to work.

[Lord_earthfire]

A: Happens a lot on accident
B: *insert wrong relic*
C: That's most doors.

As Snowy points out.. they spawned, didn't know of the hotwiring, touched the 1st door and DIED. Just having an indication something that can be shocked is fine. We have that for bolted doors too.

B) never happens on accident. You need to connect an artifact geberator over an open cable, which doesn't exist in artlab and a person need to purposefully drag ot to maintance. Beyond that, generator arts are fairly rare.

Firstly, the 3 things happening at the same time is rare. Especially c) is especially rare and most often only actually doable if you rogued the AI beforehand to have it shock the doors after you set the hotwire.

Because once the engine is hotwired, you got ~30 seconds until you got the first person crying about a hotwire over the coms.

To effective pull this off, you need a hotwire and a rogue AI.

That culmulates to the point that at least i can comfortably say that i only got door-gibbed around 2 times in my complete playtime here on goon.

And like i said, cheap dearhs are part of the game and happens. Especially if you latejoin there is simply no guarantee that the station is not in disarray and majorly trapped.

While on the topic of cheap deaths, what other kinds of cheap death are there? The only thing that I can think of would be microbomb implants, although those typically require the user to sacrifice themselves to work.

Teleport death traps (teleport gun, telescience, teleport components), NO2-traps, graviton railguns. TTV's, pipebombs, sea4, black powder, mirror-enabled ptl death ray, disposals into the singularity.

And like 1/3 of traitor and security weaponry if you get jumped with it.

point blank derringer, sleepy pen, a stun baton out of nowhere combined with a prion pill. Fibre wire (when it works like intended), syringe gun with poison bottles. Emagged hypospray.

Many stealth kills are in fact "cheap deaths". It's just that the illusion exist you could do something or you can see it coming when you metagame.

[Cal]

i dont like it either tbh

[RubberRats]

It does not actually take all that much effort to get a lethal amount of power output. Not accounting for gloves, as little as 2.5 MW gives a chance for gibbing, while 10 MW does enough burn to kill outright. Even a basic setup can reach those outputs on most engines.
The other caveat is that you can cant build a death machine in mechcomp in 30 seconds, and that you cant derringer someone from the other side of the station.

[According_tome]

This sort of "fix" would be final stepping stone of completely killing engineering I am strongly against it.

[Snowy :D]

This sort of "fix" would be final stepping stone of completely killing engineering I am strongly against it.

How so?

[Kotlol]

This sort of "fix" would be final stepping stone of completely killing engineering I am strongly against it.

How would removing insta gibbing from hotwired doors or giving a visual indicator KILL engineering?
Engineering isn't about MURDERING people with doors...

[According_tome]

This sort of "fix" would be final stepping stone of completely killing engineering I am strongly against it.

How so?

Well when you put effort into making stuff you want them to work. If they dont then why bother if it can be handled in medbay with bunch of burn meds. Immature death is part of the game. Most players find engine tedious and not satisfying they just pick the role of engineer to not to do engine or mechcomp mind you, just to do other stuff which is mostly the case nowadays. If players dont find stuff satisfying they just stop doing it. And this happens alot when we talk about engineering. Also kotol if players communicate well enough they dont require any sort of indicator

[Kotlol]

Well when you put effort into making stuff you want them to work. If they dont then why bother if it can be handled in medbay with bunch of burn meds. Immature death is part of the game. Most players find engine tedious and not satisfying they just pick the role of engineer to not to do engine or mechcomp mind you, just to do other stuff which is mostly the case nowadays. If players dont find stuff satisfying they just stop doing it. And this happens alot when we talk about engineering. Also kotol if players communicate well enough they dont require any sort of indicator

This is... the... worst... defense... for this what so ever...
But let's totally break this apart on why "communication" is a weak defense on a hotwired door death. And that's just 1 part...

Okay... you are a traitor eningeering hotwiring doors... you know communication is gonna be used to stop mass murdering.
So block the signal... With a signal blocker or two. So communication suddenly means nothing.
Or time it with a solar flare so no one can access general channels.

As rubberats points out. It's not that hard to do a hotwiring... it can take as much as 30 seconds acording to him. I am not a mech comp or engineer main but... he seems to note that hotwiring is pretty powerful.

Next up the WORST part of your reasoning:
"No one will play engineering if they can't hotwire murder players."

....You know why this sounds bad right? You make it sound like everyone who wants to roll engineering wants to murder a lot of people with a cheap and easy tactic.
So... guess what? 90% of the time... engineers can't do this since they AREN'T ANTAGONISTS THAT ROUND.
If hotwire murdering is a "CORE ESSENCE" to play Engineering... I hate to say this but... it means most of the time engineers will end up cryoing or not doing anything else.
It's like chemists only playing chemistry to Saryn bomb the station,insted of doing fun things that benefit the station too?

If hotwiring can't kill players at all or have a visual indicator to show you will die touching this door... is LITTERLY keeping people to playing Engineering... then the whole department is just bad at that point and needs serious reworking.
There is more to antagonist engineering then "HOTWIRE MURDER"
Same as Traitor Scientists having more options then "TTV Bombing"

[Snowy :D]

This sort of "fix" would be final stepping stone of completely killing engineering I am strongly against it.

How so?

Well when you put effort into making stuff you want them to work. If they dont then why bother if it can be handled in medbay with bunch of burn meds. Immature death is part of the game. Most players find engine tedious and not satisfying they just pick the role of engineer to not to do engine or mechcomp mind you, just to do other stuff which is mostly the case nowadays. If players dont find stuff satisfying they just stop doing it. And this happens alot when we talk about engineering. Also kotol if players communicate well enough they dont require any sort of indicator

Is being able to power the station not enough of an incentive to bother with it? It sounds like you’re implying that hotwires are the only reason to touch the engine which I kinda doubt is your point.

Even then, hotwires are still powerful even without the gibbing. No amount of burn meds can stop half the station’s doors from being unusable without insuls. Plus, getting to medbay in the first place is still difficult when you are nearing crit and unable to open most of the station’s doors.

I do agree that cheap deaths are something that is going to happen, but do they need to be this automated? Most cheap deaths listed in this thread require you to be involved with your targets in some way while often being more limited in terms of potential deaths.