HoP and granting Sec access in Light of The SecAss Change

[Silent Majority]

Quite simply, it needs to be axed.

If the idea of having too may veteran security officers on stomping down antags is an issue, which I can recognize, allowing every random staffie or person who asks to be sec, or have sec access, should go with it. it just creates swarms of semi security.

I could see it be something given a HOS approval, or two officers approval, to allow the HOPS computer to do so, or a computer only in the HoS's room

However, if we have the intention of reducing security, eliminating random HoP's making people security with no approval or consultation of security needs to be a thing.

I would flat be in favor of making the HoP's computer unable to grant security access..or at least, sec rolls at all, and require the HoS's id to do so.

I have not played a day in weeks that random people joined security without telling them,..Frequently antags.

[nefarious6th]

Part of game is you dont know who to trust. HoP made antag a sec assistant? Sounds like prime gameplay and a funny time. I've given these Very Obvious Infiltrators chances as HoS and they never failed to generate humor when I kept them on the team.

Part of game is on social front. Mechanical things cannot replace it. The simple radioing between hop and sec asking about who to give access to is an element that no amt of mechanical control will push one way or other. It has to come from the player.

sec access also good for helping auth armory on low pop or in rush emergency like nukies

[Silent Majority]

I'd be fine if antags did it. Its usually just rando's and clowns though. And again, now sec assistant is going to be limited to 30 or less rounds so experienced players don't just beat down antags. but anyone can be made a sec assistant at anytime.

[Lord_earthfire]

Yeez, i think the secass PR is already quite problematic (and it's not merged AND flagged as controversial). At least that should be adjusted to "rounds played as security".

This idea heavily shifts the power dynamic on the station towards security.... Which i don't think is good.

The HOP is a prime target because they csn give out most access. And as the least self-defended person on the station with security access, they are a weakpoint towards security. And security really need more weaknesses (and their stuns nerfed)

Furthermore, the HOP is an interesting weakpoint towards security, because they need RP interaction.

[Waffleloffle]

it's late and I'm shleepy so I might not be putting this as coherently as I want but I'll give it a shot

security is a department that people seem to constantly suggest be More self-sufficient. it isn't unwarranted, because sec is like billed as The role that stops everything from going to shit. that's what they bring to the station and it's undoubtedly vital that they do

at the same time, this can breed a really insular mindset, for people who main sec. actions and interactions on-station get easily boiled down to these chess matches between sec and antags while disregarding whatever freaky artifact the scientists use to turn most of artlab to soulsteel, or a mechcomp contraption a couple mechanics built that functions as a giant roulette table, or the continental breakfast spread the chef has been working on

there's so much to experience outside of security, so much more to any given round than the moment-to-moment tension and combat between The Evildoers and The Shmucks Who Get Paid To Stop The Evildoers. and I think having the HoP there to potentially allow these two streams to engage with each other in a Non-Optimal but perhaps interesting way is important to keep sec from being shut off from everyone else completely, if that makes sense

[Silent Majority]

I can see both of your points as well, Earthfire, Waffle.
I suppose this is something that goes 'with' the proposed sec ass change. I have seen people letting their friends in and causing security teams to grow to massive sizes before, One of my antag rounds there where 15 security members against me and 2 other antags, one of which joined security as a bounty hunter. the other one was sm sleepy penning people. I felt like a rat in a cage.

I suppose I can understand a HoP even GIVING sec ass, its more assigning people to the role itself.

That said insularism is a thing. I actually really enjoy talking to people outside of sec to try to listen to complaints or fears or tips, etc, but, I also get that not every one does this, and wherein this issue could lie.

I don't think this would effect classic one way or the other. everyone has aa and if they don't they'll just bash windows down and come in and packet hack the lockers anyway.

[nefarious6th]

b4 sec assistant, hop used to assign people as mime or sec assistant or clownoff or what-have-you. why remove ability in total for people to play sec at lower level than officer, assuming PR does go through? Playing sec does not always have to be playing it at highest level.

[KikiMofo]

Even if we block sec IDs from access changes they can just get a spare ID with all access on it or something.

[Silent Majority]

I'd be fine with that too kiki. And yea Nefarious that is fair, I am sort of thinking of this with the mindset OF the pr going through