Hey hey this item is really slow to pull! Fix it!

[poland spring]

Following that thought if the mailman becomes a Normal Job again I will be in support of that.

HELL YEAH BROTHERRRRR


BRING BACK MAILMAN

[Frank_Stein]

Following that thought if the mailman becomes a Normal Job again I will be in support of that.

HELL YEAH BROTHERRRRR


BRING BACK MAILMAN

I also support this, maybe as an extension of QM.
Also, a very public shipping and receiving area would be nice. Lots of departments have those as a little thing tucked away somewhere, but a dedicated area that's open to everyone would be helpful

[poland spring]

Following that thought if the mailman becomes a Normal Job again I will be in support of that.

HELL YEAH BROTHERRRRR


BRING BACK MAILMAN

I also support this, maybe as an extension of QM.
Also, a very public shipping and receiving area would be nice. Lots of departments have those as a little thing tucked away somewhere, but a dedicated area that's open to everyone would be helpful

all you'd need to do is have an open access point and a labelmaker to the right of Disposals, everyone can access that from the smelter

bonus points because it puts you directly in the line of fire for crates!

oh and if we really wanted to make things dangerous we could probably change the timing on the mass drivers to launch things much more quickly after the door opens up, so people don't have time to react

[misto]

i dont know what you guys mean when you say you cant send things thru belt hell and need a common area to send things. there are already a bunch of "common areas". near every job i can think of has some access to a belt hell in/outlet. chef, barman, hydro can send stuff from the one above kitchen. research and medical can send stuff from the one below artlab. im pretty sure chaplain has some little spot to slap stickers on and send them on the belts? engineering and security have their own belt hell backroom things im pretty sure. mining and mechanics can use the one just below escape. assistants have maint access and can reach most of these spots to send and receive things too.

the PROBLEM is that ppl FORGET the damn things exist because they dont send a pda alert on something being delivered there so anything that winds up there just sits there forgotten. and that any damage or power failure anywhere between sender and receiver means crate pileup and blockage.

new misto suggestion: make cargo transporters and the chargers for them a more common sight. any dept that has a cargo telepad to receive with should have a cargo transporter and recharger kicking around to send with. and remember that cargo telepads should pda the relevant dept ppl when something is sent to the pad

[Frank_Stein]

Them being hidden in maintenance is what I mean. I'm talking about an obvious, well lit, dedicated spot.

[misto]

them being "hidden" in maint is the whole point - theyre distributed around the place for the different workplaces to make use of. if ppl haul these crates from their workplace to this single, well lit, dedicated spot, they may as well finish hauling it to their destination on foot/with forklift. why would someone who wanted to mail something to qm, mechanics, or mining, say, bother with actually mailing it from the proposed spot next to disposals? they may as well walk a few more steps to drop it off in person

the only problem with them being in maint is that some civ jobs still do not get the maint access that even the lowliest and dumbest staff assistants do, for reasons unknown

[Sundance]

Time to address this.

Why was this change made?
Two major impacts.
1. Crates and lockers render the other transportation options on the station pointless, which is sad because the other transportation options are fun. Belt hell..Mulebots..The forklift..cargo tugs..cargo transporter...

All these fun things don't get used because pulling crates/lockers is perfect.

So it is to encourage a dead end job, QM, to start using transport methods more? One that RARELY has an operating QM in the first place? You know what a lot of peeps have been yelling about for a long time is the fact that crates aren't bought because there's no friggin need for them? That was a nerf everyone wanted. The crates that QM buy rarely leave QM proper because of this. How about addressing that instead? Honesty while I agree with the overall sentiment, the reasoning is questionable.

Dragging people. Keeping someone stunned with a baton/flash and shanking them with a fork while eluding sec, all at a full speed sprint, isn't great gameplay.
..Port-A-Med (which is not the Port-A-NanoMed) has been brought back. Security already has a Port-A-Brig.

I agree that turbo pulling is heck annoying, but resolving it with port-a-whatevers isnt going to be enough and in the end I can imagine this just making medical and security grumpy. Ive made my suggestion regarding this already.

What's up in the future?
Planned changes: Dragging an upright person who is on help intent will go full speed as it will be assumed consensual. Further refinements to the other transportation methods, like the Mulebot changes. Good suggestions in this thread or #goonstation.

The dragging a person who is on help intent sounds hacky. What's the issue with just making it upright in general? 
Ps: mulebots by in large aren't used because they suck in general (mainly because of the UI) in contrast to the other transport methods, upping the speed of them isnt enough

Why is dragging tiny thing not fast, tiny thing is tiny!

1. Dragspeed for most things you can pick up is now almost indistinguishable from full speeches

If you start throwing around the words "indistinguishable' then your entering the realms of "it's just like before" and also the realm of "why bother"
I still think this should be relegated to bulky items, sans items with wheels as the small item reasoning to put in my native tongue: fairly shite.

[misto]

Ps: mulebots by in large aren't used because they suck in general (mainly because of the UI) in contrast to the other transport methods, upping the speed of them isnt enough

good point on the ui. by the time ive rewired a mulebot to boost its speed, loaded it, and got my pda up to try to direct it(can take a few presses for the thing to recognize commands and start moving), you probably could have been most of the way there and back again in a forklift.

and yeah. qm is mostly abandoned except when somebody wants to buy some guns or tasers or stun batons or whatever, and then they just pop the crate open and grab the goods and leave it there. most other items can be acquired with a little breaking and entering on-station, unless theyve been burnt/melted/reduced to a crater. with the power laser, gambling, and couch loot qm no longer even generates relevant cash flow.

[Ed Venture]

Although I am thankful for Grayshift finally explaining his reasoning I agree with babayetu and sundance and still think the change and how it was implemented was awful and unneeded. So I'm thinking about just doing what Noah is doing and that is not playing till it's either reverted or changed to a point where it's not noticeable. Which makes me sad since after 6+ months of not being able to play cause my old PC was close to death I was having a blast playing again. That one month of my return was great be it short lived. It's either going to get better or removed and I might just stop playing for a bit to wait and see what happens. As Grayshift himself said pray for the brave players that play security in these dark times.

I just can't agree with forcing every player to use items they never needed and in some cases never asked for just because things related to the map design of CogMap2 go unused. This change just comes off to me as a punishment for not using things you want us to use.

[Grek]

From a prior thread on the subject: https://forum.ss13.co/showthread.php?tid=7282

TBH I'd be happy if QM just got the option to have a conveyor that went straight from the receiving bay to the hallway outside QM

Yes, good idea. Perhaps tie it in to the existing conveyor that leads into the hall. A segment stretched between the existing conveyors would be rad -- but it should probably be controlled by a switch to avoid it becoming a nuisance to the QM as he walks his department.

E: It would also be nice to have some crates and cargo teleporters and a cargo pad in that same room. And a forklift too, if we wanna be really fancy.

[Frank_Stein]

them being "hidden" in maint is the whole point - theyre distributed around the place for the different workplaces to make use of. if ppl haul these crates from their workplace to this single, well lit, dedicated spot, they may as well finish hauling it to their destination on foot/with forklift. why would someone who wanted to mail something to qm, mechanics, or mining, say, bother with actually mailing it from the proposed spot next to disposals? they may as well walk a few more steps to drop it off in person

the only problem with them being in maint is that some civ jobs still do not get the maint access that even the lowliest and dumbest staff assistants do, for reasons unknown

The well lit, obvious spot isn't for people to haul their stuff to, it's for the common man to accept a delivery from, as well as a place to send things from.

Example: Anyone could sell anything from anywhere, but we all know there is a specific place called the public market where most people go to when they want to sell things that is easily observable to the passerby.

Likewise, a public shipping depot would be where departments would send things to when the recipient wasn't easily designatable as something like "MEDBAY" or "SECURITY"

Spoiler!

From a prior thread on the subject: https://forum.ss13.co/showthread.php?tid=7282

TBH I'd be happy if QM just got the option to have a conveyor that went straight from the receiving bay to the hallway outside QM

Yes, good idea. Perhaps tie it in to the existing conveyor that leads into the hall. A segment stretched between the existing conveyors would be rad -- but it should probably be controlled by a switch to avoid it becoming a nuisance to the QM as he walks his department.

E: It would also be nice to have some crates and cargo teleporters and a cargo pad in that same room. And a forklift too, if we wanna be really fancy.

Yes, perfect. Exactly what I mean and in the best possible spot for using negative space and keeping the area themed

[misto]

hum hum. perhaps it is a fair idea after all. and the current belt out of the left side of qm that just dumps crates into the hallway can be removed and be replaced with sending them to this new room

[oblong]

I think the change could be very good, provided it feels natural. I would echo the opinions that pulling items you can pick up, and unstunned uncuffed people should be full speed. Anything with wheels should be reasonably quick to pull. I haven't noticed any items that haven't been mentioned yet.

Dragging people to get medbay is a problem that this might actually help to solve. I don't know how many times I've been healing myself out of crit, only to get pulled away from the meds I was trying to use by a well intentioned passer-by. It's even worse when I'm a doctor and I get my patient stolen from me so he dies when I could have saved him.

As for security: I wonder if it would be a good idea to buff the portabrig by adding a flash that can be used on the occupant. Using the portabrig is not actually time consuming as I have my pda window up at all times, the issues are getting the guy out of it (I use a floor flasher) and the fact that there is only one of them.

[Mordent]

Are people seriously planning to leave because of this? Talk about throwing your toys out of the pram...

This thread was literally created by a coder and called "Hey hey this item is really slow to pull! Fix it!", and some things have been adjusted because of feedback.

I'm fine with pulling anything slowing you down (even marginally), as it gives someone chasing you after you grabbed it a chance to get it back. Yes, this makes things harder for antagonists, so just adjust your strategies a bit. Being stunned then dragged off to be spaced is infuriatingly common, anything that makes that a little less viable is great in my book.

Anything with wheels should be treated as a marginal slowdown, as said by folks already, unless it has significant mass. I haven't had a chance to play extensively with the changes, but off the top of my head I think that medical gurneys and carts (both janitor and cargo ones) need to be in the marginal slowdown category (I remember reading a few pages back something about gurneys, but the topic was massively derailed so I've forgotten about it by now, so this may already have been done).

Stick a few spare carts about in maintenance and put some in relevant departments (engineering, tool storage, robotics, mechanics - anyone who works with materials, basically), and put some resprited (or in some cases just renamed) ones in various places (the hotdog cart, a drinks cart, a produce cart) and you're done. Don't make them too commonplace, but make it so that each department has some form of easy transport available (albeit in limited quantity) and I think 90% of people's complaints here will stop.

If you want to go all-out, add "wheels" to the nano-fabricator and let them make carts (four wheels, and six sheets). Bonus points for doing this solely because then you could make a pizza delivery cart out of pizza.

People-dragging is the only real variable that affects a lot of people significantly, and I'm fine with the change in general (I would go as far as making grabbed pulling slower as well). I like the idea of having people with the help intent easier to drag (it implies cooperation with the dragger rather than resistance), or that the default speed is increased partly but players can slow down their dragger by spamming "resist".

[ZeWaka]

Ps: mulebots by in large aren't used because they suck in general (mainly because of the UI) in contrast to the other transport methods, upping the speed of them isnt enough

You do know that the UI was updated recently, right?



also it now depends if they are standing or lying down