Security Abuse

[FrontlineAcrobat4]

There aren't any flushers. What's so bad about the cycling airlock? I don't really see why it's at all hard to use, expect when guards end up locking themselves in, and that is hilarious.

I get it that you want the Brig to be styled like a County jail, but it very hard to use when the people in the general population cell are more than willing to let someone smash their skull into a window just to get a glass shard to cut open the grille. Not only this, but you really do not have any method to stop another person pushing their way out of the cell except for flashbanging them, which is shitty.

I'm fine with the gen pop so long as there is floor flusher in there, I think Ursela mentioned that it would be possible for an officer to stamp people with stickers that work with the floor flusher?

[Clarks]

If you jail people, you're playing wrong.

For small crimes, cuff somebody and give them a stern lecture/good YELL in the nearest room.
If they have stolen something important or from other players, take it away and return it.
If they have done something wrong out of inexperience, explain to them.

The time it takes to do the above is usually punishment enough.

When do I brig? If I catch someone attacking people over and over, and they have already been given a chance.
When they are actively ruining other people's game, not committing some silly "crime".

If it is a traitor, for a couple of minutes as a sort of punishment and "rehabilitation" (yeah, right).


The more time you spend in the brig, while you're sec, the less people you have a chance to help out (and, yes, they do remember); and more likely it will be that you have to face a few riotous dumbasses.

The current brig works well, and the lack of automatic timing requires you to decide whether the time spent watching an inmate would be better spent elsewhere.

[mozi]

clarks thats dumb youre dumb

the jail setup is inconvenient and annoying -> security is apprehensive to brig anyone -> people aware that they really have nothing to lose since sec can't do anything else -> they will attempt to mob security all the time because best case scenario, they score a bunch of free shit, worst case scenario, they get stunned and dragged outside

[Clarks]

Ok, if you enjoy playing warden to a bunch of pretend criminals, who am I to stop you?

I get so much less grief doing it my way, and streetcop/occasional hero beats spending time scuffling in the brig or watching a guy scream at you from the other side of the window.

[FrontlineAcrobat4]

Taking someone out of the round for a period of time is the only thing security can do to punish people other than killing them. Im not sure how the fuck you think telling someone to stop it then not doing to anything to actually stop them will make them somehow magically respect you and become a reformed member of society.

Also try and stun the ten people sitting outside of Security busting in and yell at them to stop, because they know you have no actual way of stopping them if they decide to kick your ass.

[Cogwerks]

Ok, if you enjoy playing warden to a bunch of pretend criminals, who am I to stop you?

I get so much less grief doing it my way, and streetcop/occasional hero beats spending time scuffling in the brig or watching a guy scream at you from the other side of the window.

did you know: it can actually be very fun to piss those people off and just laugh at their tantrums

[Clarks]

They are the very same people who throw a tantrum when you give them a LOUD YELLING. I'm not missing out.

Then there is the large number of officers who arrest somebody and drag them to the brig, and search them and throw them to jail without ever saying a word.

And the other ones who get baited into overreacting by some dumb assistant. They go sour over a shove or a punch, and all they care is hunting down that guy.

If security usually acted reasonably, we wouldn't be having the nth argument about making the jail easier and quicker to use.

[Sundance]

hmm

I'm not saying clarks is wrong, but what I am saying that sec shouldn't be punished for using a system that's already there.

If you want to be good cop, and talk to them, give em coffee and donuts and a nice chit-chat, that's up to you
If you want to be bad cop and threaten them with brigging, demotion or high bail, that's up to you.

Currently the new system is favoring the former which is summarized nicely my mozi, I see alot of inexperienced sec getting their asses literally handed to them because they don't know how to work the new brig cells properly.

Another thing that's a real big issue here is stripping a player. Obviously I can't leave a player with stuff to break out with, so where do I put his stuff. So much shit gets misplaced.

I am almost tempted to ask for the glass to be removed in the general population, so you just have a shocked grill. That'd be interesting heheh.

[Cogwerks]

What is so difficult about the new cell door? Shove a guy into the entry, toggle the button next to you. By all rights it should be vastly easier than the old system. I have no idea why anyone is confused by it, and frankly if a new guard is too inept to operate that, I'll just go ahead and laugh at them when their prisoner escapes.

If that is too hard SOMEHOW, just stuff them in the food delivery chute instead.

[Tteckk]

As a security officer, your more then welcome to brig someone for stealing a pen, Ill even arrest someone for breathing my air. Cogy is right, its a lot of fun watching a prisoner cry in the cells and I personally count the times im called bad security, It means your doing your job correctly.
I like the door system, however to 'punish' a prisoner in the cell you will need someone on the outside to let you out, which is a hassle.
A timer and flusher system would be nice. More then not you don't have the time to release people before you get caught up in someones rampage.

[Cogwerks]

Yeah, the release system could use some work. I'll see what I can do about that.

[Niars]

I had a good round as Sec a few days ago. An engineer had gone a bit greysuit and toolboxed a chef to death. He was hiding behind the bar. I'm not brilliant at robusting as SS13 client lags to hell for me, so I ordered him to lie down and wait for me to cuff him, and he did.

That was the amazing part. I brigged him for 3 minutes and dragged him out when his time was up. No problems.

[MEOW POW]

worst case scenario, they get stunned and dragged outside

This is exactly what happened. I couldn't deal with so much shit being thrown at me and trying to fuck with the new doors that I just stunned them (If I even could do that, since there were about 4 assistants spamming disarm on me in the Security office.) and threw them outside, of course they escaped with headsets and shit, but what am I supposed to do? I can't just sit there arresting them one by one and shoving them into the new door.

Ok, if you enjoy playing warden to a bunch of pretend criminals, who am I to stop you?
I get so much less grief blah blah

You get less grief because the second you uncuff them and walk away they go back to whatever they were doing, because you're not actually punishing them.

Then there is the large number of officers who arrest somebody and drag them to the brig, and search them and throw them to jail without ever saying a word.

I'm going to assume by saying this you're implying that I was doing that. I wasn't. I was very vocal with the crew and announcing over radio that I'd detained someone and how long I was jailing them for. I was as polite as I could possibly be, informing prisoners of what I was doing to them ("I'm going to remove your backpack, and place it in Contraband until you're released. etc) before Security began to get swarmed.

I am almost tempted to ask for the glass to be removed in the general population, so you just have a shocked grill. That'd be interesting heheh.

SOMETHING has to be done about the glass. If you put two assholes in there they'll just throw each other at the window until it breaks. Outrageous.

What is so difficult about the new cell door?

It's hard because the assholes you brig constantly try to get out of your grasp, if they slip away for a SECOND, they'll run around like headless chickens in security to fuck with you. It's annoying, and I'd rather just drag them into a cell, flash them, uncuff them and then set a timer for them to leave and their locker to open so I can be elsewhere.

I'm fine with the gen pop so long as there is floor flusher in there, I think Ursela mentioned that it would be possible for an officer to stamp people with stickers that work with the floor flusher?

This would be awesome, placing a little sticker on them and remotely setting their time on a console outside the cells would be great, when their time it could announce over the radio, or just in speakers in jail that "JOHN MCPUBBIE HAS BEEN REHABILITATED" or "PUBBS MCGEE, YOUR TIME IS UP.", A flusher would open that would only work for them, and they could go.

[Weavel]

Fun fact: there's a disposal unit right beside the big cell that puts people right inside. Stun them and flush them rather than trying to fuck about with the door.

A floor flusher to remove people would be nice, but I don't really see the problem with the windows; they can't get through the grille without gloves or tools, and if you didn't search them well enough to remove these, then you deserve a break-out on your hands.
Even if they start using shards, that's 45 seconds to remove the cuffs, another 25 or so to bonk the glass out in best-case with a welder, then the shard on the grille is another 30 seconds-ish; if you've put someone in the big cell for more than two minutes, and you haven't kept an eye on them OR searched them for break-out equipment, well, who's fault is that?

Yes, Sec is getting flooded, but it's no worse than it was before; if you just simply don't open the doors to the lockers, then they can't get equipment, and if you just pay some goddamn attention to the front door, you won't have shits flooding you. If they're in the room, they've got three clicks to beat you and you've got one with multiple choices as to your method. You need to be more robust if you're losing every time an assistant walks past.

[FrontlineAcrobat4]

Yeah, the release system could use some work. I'll see what I can do about that.

The general population cells in Donut and Shroom station had one sliding door, that led to a small corridor that had a floor flusher in it, and another sliding door leading to the brig. Maybe something like that?