Why was derringers nerfed?

[Spy_Guy]

In this case I'll have the same opinion as I had on the chameleon bombs: the power of the item in itself is an important aspect of it. That said, 12 shots that each instantly crit people is nothing to sneeze at, so perhaps the price could be upped to match the power (and higher amount of spending crystals)?

[BaneOfGiygas]

But here's the thing: Yes, the derringer is a really powerful weapon, but it's effectively disposable. Two shots and that's your lot. Microbombs and pipe bombs are of similar cost to the derringer, are also single-use, but also pack a helluva lot of punch. Hell, a well-timed microbomb explosion lets you gib multiple people if you position yourself accordingly.

[Marquesas]

In this case I'll have the same opinion as I had on the chameleon bombs: the power of the item in itself is an important aspect of it. That said, 12 shots that each instantly crit people is nothing to sneeze at, so perhaps the price could be upped to match the power (and higher amount of spending crystals)?

Well, the issue is people were rather adamant about continuing to be able to stuff derringers into every orifice.



On that note
The derringer is now AP again. What does this mean in practice? You get some of your bonus damage back. The damage amp was a bug that will not be returning and its effects will not be replicated.
Please test the effects now.

[Sundance]

Wouldn't two 125-brute shots put you into extremely deep crit with a fairly high chance of killing the target near-instantly?

Anyhow, as I read it, the reason Marq nerfed the derringer was that, before his change, derringers did half damage against unarmored people and triple damage (plus negating the armor's protective effects) against people wearing weak armor.

Then I agree changing this so that it's effectively 125 brute damage point blank-damage across the board, whether it be someone with armor or not. That's fair. That's reasonable.

Any less damage then there's no point. I hear people in this thread going along with the assumption that when you use the derringer you're almost guaranteed 125 brute damage.
For the last time: you are not
First off there's the big red message, and despite what marq said i've come across plenty of people who wary of me approaching them into combat range seeing the message and sprinting as far away as possible. Secondly as bane pointed out, the derringer shot damage decreases substantially over range, and completely dropping off at 4 tiles. Finally: Miss the first shot, chances are you won't land the second. You only got two.
The resulting 3 factors makes the derringer a completely situational item

It's really mind racking to think of all the things that had to be nerfed it would be the very humble derringer. :911:
If anything, nerf chemistry. Yes I totally went there. Come at me.

In this case I'll have the same opinion as I had on the chameleon bombs: the power of the item in itself is an important aspect of it. That said, 12 shots that each instantly crit people is nothing to sneeze at, so perhaps the price could be upped to match the power (and higher amount of spending crystals)?

Well, the issue is people were rather adamant about continuing to be able to stuff derringers into every orifice.



On that note
The derringer is now AP again. What does this mean in practice? You get some of your bonus damage back. The damage amp was a bug that will not be returning and its effects will not be replicated.
Please test the effects now.

How about instead of us guessing, let us know what the damage the derringer now does, given that it was 125-brute damage prenerf.

[Marquesas]

If anything, nerf chemistry. Yes I totally went there. Come at me.

Are you sure you would you like to open this particular can of worms?

ABORT RETRY CANCEL

How about instead of us guessing, let us know what the damage the derringer now does, given that it was 125-brute damage prenerf.

Calm your fucking entitled tits, jesus.

125 power, retains full power for 1 tick, after which it dissipates by 25/tick. Is armor-piercing, which means it does full damage for armor values 1-3, half damage to armor value 0, and (power/(armor/3)) for armor values greater than 3.

[Dabir]

Let's talk cost efficiency. The purpose of the derringer, from what I can tell, is to make someone drop the fuck dead. While technically with two uses, it functionally has only one use. It is designed to kill. Making it "fair" utterly defeats to purpose.

Now, let's talk parallels. A poison bottle only costs 1 TC, though often requires a 5 TC sleepy pen for maximum effectiveness. A poison bottle can hold enough poison to directly kill 0 to 8+ people. At optimal efficiency, plus the sleepy pen, a poison bottle ropes in a whooping 1.333 TC per kill. While the poison roulette and decreasing cost efficiency with multiple poison bottles justify the 1TC price, but that's just an example of kill to TC price ratio.

You get 3 shanks with a scalpel from a poison bottle, each dip consumes 15 units and puts 5 units on the scalpel. If you get one of the many, many poisons that Just Kill You from five units, like space heartworms, or one of the three kinds of initro, or pure bacon grease, or nanomachines, or prions, that's 0.333 TC per kill, and that's when you're wasteful. A derringer gives you one guaranteed instant kill, two significantly slower ones if you're willing to push your luck.