Goonhub
10-02-2025, 09:17 AM
(This post was last modified: 10-02-2025, 09:49 AM by Taylorstar. Edited 2 times in total.)
Hi folks, Recently I experimented and refined my approach as a vampire antag focusing on the batform after seeing another player use it extremely well a few things clicked and I realized how exploitable and over powered it is, one of my biggest things in video games for fun is there needs to be action and reaction, cause and consequence, play and counter play as it where which is why I would like to make some suggestions which I think could not only make playing a vampire bat more interesting but also give other players options to defend (not attack per say) against the vampire.
These are just ideas and I wonder what people think about them? Also If people have other ideas and the advantages and disadvantages of the ideas that get shared here as I would love to read them.
Currently the Vampire bat form is immune to everything. There is no counter play at all whatsoever nothing can stop it. If someone has found a neat little loop, set up some convenient hurdles and obstacles they can evade/disengage easier than any other antag. I would like to suggest the following things to counter a vampire bat.
1) Flashbangs should be an instant and lengthy stun knocking the vampire bat out of batform. Most grenades have audio que's letting people know a pin has been pulled so there is play and counter play on both sides.
2) Gas clouds should be another strong deterrent for bats, whether its grenades, beakers rafflesia/hotboxes. I would like to propose that in batform there is 0% chemical resistance, even if the player character has a gas mask on, in batform there is no way a gas mask would fit realistically. This opens up great ways to contain a bat with either stun or damaging chemicals like capsaicin or holy water, the counter play there is no only audio ques from grenades or beakers but visibility too, the vampire can see clouds and be deterred or get ensnared and see whats got them, in my opinion its a fair and valid play counter play balance, most certainly in the absence of there being none.
3) Loud noises I'm not sure if these would also fall under flashbangs, but oxygen grenades give a stun effect, other things that I could see potentially hindering/debilitating a bat could include the microphone/speakers, The Megaphone, to a lesser effect I feel that maybe even bells like the HoP bell or chef bell could disorientate a bat causing them to think twice about lingering around that area as a vampire bat. Though on reflection I think a number of these things could lean towards disorientate rather than stun.
4) Bodies of Water We already have salt stopping wraiths from crossing and seeing through things, what about if we used the same approach with puddles of water on the floor, easy to produce just as quick to disappear, I could see vampires carrying mops to counter this comically enough but someone coming out of batform even if its only for half a second is more than enough for sec to pounce on a cornered bat. Of course I think in normal form they should just be able to walk over it unless it contained holy water in which case its a stroll through acid.
5) Reagent Extraction When I first started I wondered what would happen if a vampire drank the blood of someone who was tanked up on ethanol would the vampire get drunk, to my disappointment the vampire only gets blood from its victim. What if vampires took a percentage of reagent in someones blood stream suddenly loading up on garlic makes your blood toxic to vampires if they are flying around being a pest, a temporary version of being a chaplain on the flipside if a vampire took damage in combat and is drinking the blood of someone who has healing chems it restores them. Additionally a criminally underused feature of the codebase which could now becomes a tempting and viable strategy is that of cyborg kidneys/intestines which can be used to slow down all reagent drain in your system.
These are just some ideas I have that I think are a fair and reasonably sound idea in terms of game design on what can counter and hinder a currently untouchable and very exploitable/cheese able ability.
I do think not being able to be hit by projectiles like tasers and bullets should remain because if all of these features where to come into effect it might be too heavy handed of a nerf and make the ability simply unviable or a very niche use instead.
These are just ideas and I wonder what people think about them? Also If people have other ideas and the advantages and disadvantages of the ideas that get shared here as I would love to read them.
Currently the Vampire bat form is immune to everything. There is no counter play at all whatsoever nothing can stop it. If someone has found a neat little loop, set up some convenient hurdles and obstacles they can evade/disengage easier than any other antag. I would like to suggest the following things to counter a vampire bat.
1) Flashbangs should be an instant and lengthy stun knocking the vampire bat out of batform. Most grenades have audio que's letting people know a pin has been pulled so there is play and counter play on both sides.
2) Gas clouds should be another strong deterrent for bats, whether its grenades, beakers rafflesia/hotboxes. I would like to propose that in batform there is 0% chemical resistance, even if the player character has a gas mask on, in batform there is no way a gas mask would fit realistically. This opens up great ways to contain a bat with either stun or damaging chemicals like capsaicin or holy water, the counter play there is no only audio ques from grenades or beakers but visibility too, the vampire can see clouds and be deterred or get ensnared and see whats got them, in my opinion its a fair and valid play counter play balance, most certainly in the absence of there being none.
3) Loud noises I'm not sure if these would also fall under flashbangs, but oxygen grenades give a stun effect, other things that I could see potentially hindering/debilitating a bat could include the microphone/speakers, The Megaphone, to a lesser effect I feel that maybe even bells like the HoP bell or chef bell could disorientate a bat causing them to think twice about lingering around that area as a vampire bat. Though on reflection I think a number of these things could lean towards disorientate rather than stun.
4) Bodies of Water We already have salt stopping wraiths from crossing and seeing through things, what about if we used the same approach with puddles of water on the floor, easy to produce just as quick to disappear, I could see vampires carrying mops to counter this comically enough but someone coming out of batform even if its only for half a second is more than enough for sec to pounce on a cornered bat. Of course I think in normal form they should just be able to walk over it unless it contained holy water in which case its a stroll through acid.
5) Reagent Extraction When I first started I wondered what would happen if a vampire drank the blood of someone who was tanked up on ethanol would the vampire get drunk, to my disappointment the vampire only gets blood from its victim. What if vampires took a percentage of reagent in someones blood stream suddenly loading up on garlic makes your blood toxic to vampires if they are flying around being a pest, a temporary version of being a chaplain on the flipside if a vampire took damage in combat and is drinking the blood of someone who has healing chems it restores them. Additionally a criminally underused feature of the codebase which could now becomes a tempting and viable strategy is that of cyborg kidneys/intestines which can be used to slow down all reagent drain in your system.
These are just some ideas I have that I think are a fair and reasonably sound idea in terms of game design on what can counter and hinder a currently untouchable and very exploitable/cheese able ability.
I do think not being able to be hit by projectiles like tasers and bullets should remain because if all of these features where to come into effect it might be too heavy handed of a nerf and make the ability simply unviable or a very niche use instead.
