Server: Classic, but this mostly happened over Discord
Date + time: 06.06.2024. around 23:50 GMT+2
Synopsis:
Mir held a pre-game admin event/show, and I thought it would be funny to say "boo get off the stage" as a joke. What I didn't know is that she usually gets comments/harassment like this from toxic people who genuinely mean what they say, especially on Classic. I got my character superfarted on and a 5 minute ban for this (at the time I thought Mir said this as a joke, especially because the superfart was kinda funny). None of this even really affected me since I wasn't planning on joining that round.
While I do I was in the wrong for saying that now and that I should've thought about what I was saying more, out of principle I don't think a ban, no matter how short, was needed here. An admin PM would've sufficed and I feel like the whole situation could've passed the same except without what happened next.
After the round I commented in #space-chat about how I found the superfart execution funny, and Mir responded with a ban log of somebody else who made an ahelp saying "this show sucked". I asked Mir if she seriously decided to give a 5 minute ban for the two of us, to which she said yes and told me she gets a lot of harassment like this and that she talks about it in chat a lot. I said I didn't know as I don't play RP /look at #space-chat often, I said I felt like the ban was unfair, but whatever what's done is done, and apologised... to which my apology got completely ignored multiple times, I get called a shithead and was told to stop arguing. Fair enough, I didn't want to flood chat with this, especially because at this point the bans wore off like nothing happened, but I did see them in chat about half an hour later and apologised for the third time, and got completely ignored again.
Extra information/TLDR: I don't really care what happens, I just don't want to be on bad terms with anyone and wish my apology gets acknowledged, optionally accepted, and I get one back if Mir feels like giving me one.
PS I have almost the entire admin event recorded and can send the video from my perspective if need be
that sort of thing is why i spent quite more than 5 minutes writing out an announcement for pre-games (adding another step to the process) saying "don't do that"
Quote:I asked Mir if she seriously decided to give a 5 minute ban for the two of us, to which she said yes ... I said I felt like the ban was unfair
Quote:she seriously decided to give a 5 minute ban for the two of us
Quote:a 5 minute ban
you have spent far more than five minutes writing this post. i spent well more than 5 minutes dealing with it.
the problem statement is indeed the one you quoted:
Quote:[3:01 PM]Zedorfska: I still think its a bit stupid to ban for something like this that not everyone could know, but whatever I will not argue it
this thing you're doing here is something i'm very familiar with (because i do it all the time, too): it's called a parting shot. "I think it was stupid, but I'm not going to argue" -- that is arguing it right there, and then trying to shut down the argument by saying you're not actually arguing it. "I don't think what I did was that bad."
you had to wait 5 minutes before you could go back to what you were doing.
i had to wait an hour for the next round.
idk. i find it hard to feel anything for this post beyond "play stupid games, win stupid prizes". it was five minutes. literally get out of your chair and walk around the house.
(06-09-2024, 12:00 PM)Zamujasa Wrote: that sort of thing is why i spent quite more than 5 minutes writing out an announcement for pre-games (adding another step to the process) saying "don't do that"
this thing you're doing here is something i'm very familiar with (because i do it all the time, too): it's called a parting shot. "I think it was stupid, but I'm not going to argue" -- that is arguing it right there, and then trying to shut down the argument by saying you're not actually arguing it. "I don't think what I did was that bad."
you had to wait 5 minutes before you could go back to what you were doing.
i had to wait an hour for the next round.
idk. i find it hard to feel anything for this post beyond "play stupid games, win stupid prizes". it was five minutes. literally get out of your chair and walk around the house.
As someone who was there in call (mute during round, talk about it after the round ends) explaining the pregame show to them watching that message be sent (Before you or I had explained WHAT the pregame show was) and knowing what was about to happen because of how I know your pregame show has been abused. I am the recommendation mentioned in the title of the post and I feel like you have completely missed the mark with what they had to say with the following key points:
>They didn't mind the ban, and went off to go to bed, something they were about to do anyway, like you suggested they do in your response.
>They felt like an admin PM would have been much better as it wouldn't have interrupted the show and would have told them why they shouldn't have done this.
>They felt their attempts to apologize were completely ignored and brushed off.
I recommended this feedback because they said they felt they couldn't make a report about it and I didn't want new players to get scared off by what might seem to someone unaware like a "harsh" admin, something that was immediately mentioned by a TG player who joined the conversation while I was telling them to make this feedback. There is another player with a similar feedback made recently in a similar scenario, apologizing for what they said after being unaware.
I greatly appreciate the pregame show and so do many people and I hate to see it interrupted because someone made a joke they didn't know the connotations around, I think the solution this feedback was seeking has mostly been found in a "Do not boo the pregame show" message.
I would also like to say personally that I think you are assuming exactly what kind of person they are with your responses being treating them like someone who cant stop playing games and never gets out the house and I would like to say this is completely incorrect. Zedorfska is the most "life-having" person I know that plays SS13.
Pretty much what JORJ said. The parting shot part is by definition incorrect, at the time I really wanted to speak up for myself, but realised it would only cause more flood to #space-chat, so I held off from further comments and left the rest of what I had to say to this thread, I should have made that clear then but feared you would ban me as you've also given me a timeout for simply asking whether I was banned.
Three times have I tried apologising to you over Discord to which I was returned insults, and now that I'm doing so again privately you are responding in the same fashion, saying I don't have a life while ignoring 50% of my original post. I did genuinely try to give it my all to make up and be on good terms with you, but to me it seems as if your first negative experience with me makes you only focus on the negatives I bring up, rather than seeing I'm trying to apologise. I am sad this is the case.
06-16-2024, 10:45 PM (This post was last modified: 06-16-2024, 10:49 PM by goober_one.)
I'm going to be siding with @zamujasa here. I feel like what they did was justified. There are messages that say "Don't boo the pregame show" for a reason. You just sort of.. ignored that. Even if it was as a joke. I'm not a big fan of that.
(06-16-2024, 05:54 PM)zedorfska Wrote: Pretty much what JORJ said. The parting shot part is by definition incorrect, at the time I really wanted to speak up for myself, but realised it would only cause more flood to #space-chat, so I held off from further comments and left the rest of what I had to say to this thread, I should have made that clear then but feared you would ban me as you've also given me a timeout for simply asking whether I was banned.
Three times have I tried apologising to you over Discord to which I was returned insults, and now that I'm doing so again privately you are responding in the same fashion, saying I don't have a life while ignoring 50% of my original post. I did genuinely try to give it my all to make up and be on good terms with you, but to me it seems as if your first negative experience with me makes you only focus on the negatives I bring up, rather than seeing I'm trying to apologise. I am sad this is the case.
You're especially making them out to be more of an asshole than anything I've seen, and I don't really see any proof here. I'm sorry if I'm airing on the side of caution here and your experience might seriously be real, but this sorta behavior is common among complainers that ended up... actually getting really pissed for doing something clearly disliked or against rules.
You're especially making them out to be more of an asshole than anything I've seen, and I don't really see any proof here. I'm sorry if I'm airing on the side of caution here and your experience might seriously be real, but this sorta behavior is common among complainers that ended up... actually getting really pissed for doing something clearly disliked or against rules. I feel like this might be an example of over-exaggeration.
Oopsies! It doubleposted. That's on me, pologies!
Hello goober. I absolutely would say ignoring apologies and returning insults is kind of being an asshole... And as I have stated, I've never seen any sort of pre-game show hosted by any admin ever, and there were no signs/rules in-game that booing the show was not allowed.
Another thing I wanted to add is that they're constantly implying I completely ruined the show for them and others, when they easily could've ignored my message, or sent me an admin PM, which would have achieved the exact same effect as what they did but without this mess.
Rather than fully stopping the show to do the execution bit, they could've continued on and nobody elses experience of the show would be affected.
This will probably be my last reply as its been a week since this happened and frankly, I feel like I have tried everything.
As a final TLDR of what my goals with this were:
In their favour
- I wanted to acknowledge that I should have thought more about what the game show really is for, before (not) sending that.
- I wanted to apologise again, after doing so three times over Discord.
And in my favour
- I wanted to point out that I feel like no matter how small, actions done here were unjust. Mostly because of the fact there were no warnings prior to this, at least not something I would have seen, as I've only loaded in about 80 seconds until roundstart, and I do not look at #space-chat often enough to be aware admins get serious harassment like this.
- I wanted to point out that my attempts to talk civilly were returned with insults, multiple times.
I am in no way am trying to make any of these comments seem harsh or passive aggressive, and I am trying to not let my emotions make me biased. I do not like being insulted, especially when I only had good intentions.
You are not owed having your apology accepted or acknowledged. Whether or not an apology is accepted is fully and completely up to the person being apologized to. Not accepting or acknowledging an apology is not rude.
(06-16-2024, 10:45 PM)goober_one Wrote: I'm going to be siding with @zamujasa here. I feel like what they did was justified. There are messages that say "Don't boo the pregame show" for a reason. You just sort of.. ignored that. Even if it was as a joke. I'm not a big fan of that.
that announcement was something i added in response to the events that created this thread, as well as people previously heckling me.
it wasn't present during the round this happened.
Quote:- I wanted to point out that I feel like no matter how small, actions done here were unjust. Mostly because of the fact there were no warnings prior to this, at least not something I would have seen, as I've only loaded in about 80 seconds until roundstart, and I do not look at #space-chat often enough to be aware admins get serious harassment like this.
there are three things i keep coming back to about how i decided to do what i did.
one, you were heckling a host in front of 40-80 people (i don't know the exact counts and it varies between servers). if this was an actual physical show, even one held for free in a park or whatever, if someone started making a disturbance like that, they would be immediately shown out, regardless of if it's a recurring problem. it's rude, it's disruptive to the person doing it, as well as all the people trying to watch.
two, it was a short public shaming followed by a five minute ban. i have routinely put people in shamecubes on classic for particularly egregious or annoying behavior before. it is a part of discouragement: "i shouldn't do this because then i'd end up like that." you were made an example of, because you provided yourself that way.
three, even if you were not already aware, your first decision in front of a huge group of people was, unique across them, to boo and heckle. you were the only person out of that group to do that. and i think that, out of this, it would be better to reflect on why that was.
you shouldn't need to know that someone's seen abuse to think better about harassing people. read the room.
was i an asshole to you? absolutely. was it a bit much? i can see the argument.
but my stance is that you shouldn't need a warning to not be a jerk. especially not to someone standing in front of 40 others.
Goonhub
