[PR] Contributor Rewards accessible to all

[Zamujasa]

edit: here's a better example with (random) hairstyles

the hairs seem to be more of the issue than anything in the image. if those are hairs from random appearance spawning, it seems like more of a point toward refining how they roll. anything will look bad when layered with several eye bleeding colors of bangs or half of a hairstyle, skin color aside. we do have variables for them already, but it could be a good idea to make them all one color as well? it also just seems odd that someone would go through the trouble of picking traits, especially an appearance modifying trait, if they were going to roll a random appearance. if the goal Was to make an incredibly gruesome design, crimes against aesthetics done purposefully can already be done pretty easily, showcased here by the clash of hairs, clothing, and other existing traits like plant arms coming into play.

they are random hair styles as chosen by 10 units of unstable omega hairgrownium, because i didn't care to try and come up with "normal" examples, and because imo it wouldn't be a fair comparison if they were chosen intentionally to look "nice". the colors i picked for skin color were semi-random (mostly just tried to pick saturated colors i hadn't yet)

because the same thing about hair applies to players: generally speaking most people want to look coherent and nice, and thus you aren't going to get a constant mess of technicolor hues. but it feels like we have to work from the assumption that every single person will want to look like a foil trading card and there's not really anything one can say about that beyond shrugging.

[mintyphresh]

The image Zamu posted with the bright-ass colors is being inspected a lot here, so here's a more descriptive image of what the PR allows, attempting to cover a wide range of saturations, values, and hues. 2, 3, 5, 6, and 8 are all at the border of allowable colors, as per this PR's restrictions.

[Lord_earthfire]

I think i run into the danger here off touching something off-topic here, but i feel like a lot of people, on RP at least, don't really like it to see... let's call it creative use of naming and customizing mechanics.

I've seen people having their first name "DR." or people play litteral cyborgs being put into human skin suits and other akward configurations. Personsally, i am not a fan of these already and this PR will make this development even worse (mind you, i stil accept them existing and play with it, but its an oddball for me)

If we want the common crewmember to be visually unique, distinct and the station population to be a ragtag group of fancy/unique main-characters, then yeah, this PR is great.

If we want to common crewmember to be a number in the system and want NT to tell their employeee "i don't care sbout your fancy degree, you are a fucking janitor now", this PR isn't a great idea.

Character customisation can be immersion- and setting-breaking. And i think this PR crosses that border.

[Meggal Bozale]

My eyes really glazed over this thread, but honestly?

nuke all the eccentric skin colors, give contributors funny tshirts and cups. I agree with Mordent here.

I personally would like to see humans have human skin colors, and anyone who wants to have something off the list of roundstart customization can go to genetics / get paint / play a lizard. We do this kind of gatekeeping for plenty of things, even clothing and monkeys, so I don't see why this is something necessary at roundstart. If someone really wants to play a neon-pink staffie, they can go to genetics. Same is true for people really want to play monkeys (Grup comes to mind), go to genetics and get the thing.

[mintyphresh]

I think i eun into the danger here off touching sonethibg off-topic here, but i feel like a lot of people, on RP at least, don't really like it to see... let's call it creative use of naming and customizing mechanics.

I've seen people having their first name "DR." or people play litteral cyborgs being put into human skin suits and other akward configurations. Personsally, i am not a fan of these already and this PR will make this development even worse (mind you, i stil acc3pt them existing and play with it, but its an oddball for me)

If we want the common crewmember to be visually unique, distinct and the station population to be a ragtag group of fancy/unique main-characters, then yeah, this PR is great.

If we want to common crewmember to be a number in the system and want NT to tell their employeee "i don't care sbout your fancy degree, you are a fucking janitor now", this PR isn't a great idea.

Character customisation can be immersion- and setting-breaking. And i think this PR crosses that border.

I don't really think cyborg bioshells and custom skin tones are immersion- or setting-breaking, considering both of those can be done within the round. Changing skin color is non-invasive and takes mere seconds to complete, so it's not unreasonable to think that the crew may have gotten it done at Central, or during a previous shift.

[Zamujasa]

I think i run into the danger here off touching something off-topic here, but i feel like a lot of people, on RP at least, don't really like it to see... let's call it creative use of naming and customizing mechanics.

those people can make their opinions known instead of being maybe spoken for by you, imo, esp because

I've seen people having their first name "DR." or people play litteral cyborgs being put into human skin suits and other akward configurations. Personsally, i am not a fan of these already and this PR will make this development even worse (mind you, i stil accept them existing and play with it, but its an oddball for me)

i genuinely do not understand people who have hangups over someone having "doctor" as part of their first name and i don't think i ever will. that is an actual title you can have in real life and interacting with anyone at a basic care place will have you hearing many people referred to as "doctor [lastname]".

If we want the common crewmember to be visually unique, distinct and the station population to be a ragtag group of fancy/unique main-characters, then yeah, this PR is great.

If we want to common crewmember to be a number in the system and want NT to tell their employeee "i don't care sbout your fancy degree, you are a fucking janitor now", this PR isn't a great idea.

personally i enjoy playing this game with a cast of somewhat recognizable, visually-distinct people; i am not here to play, and do not want to play, with a bunch of visually-similar NPCs, or to even think of other players as "random numbers"; and even then, nothing stops a HoP or whoever from demoting / promoting people. if you can't do that because someone looks too interesting, that's a big skill issue on your part.



fwiw i also strongly disagree with the "just play a lizard!" because that comes with its own host of customization drawbacks and gameplay issues (and a trait point, to add insult to injury).

[Mordent]

those people can make their opinions known instead of being maybe spoken for by you

Hi.

i genuinely do not understand people who have hangups over someone having "doctor" as part of their first name and i don't think i ever will

I also don't like people jamming stuff into the names field that isn't their name (for non-gimmick roles). This applies to titles as well as unconventionally structured names (e.g. Elder Scrolls Argonian Verbs-the-Noun lizard names). These in addition to other things, as well as non-standard human skin colors adversely affect the setting vibe for me.

i enjoy playing this game with a cast of somewhat recognizable, visually-distinct people

Same. I also think there's enough options available esp. with hair styles and uniform "accents" (changing out your shoes, backpack, outer layer, hat), and don't think your base uniform or full-spectrum skin color changes are needed as part of that and that there are more-than-sufficient options already.

I don't like non-standard hues in the same way that I think running around with a pink-and-neon-blue "camo" and a golden weapon looks ridiculous in games like Call of Duty (and the move towards that is one of many reasons I don't play CoD).

At the end of the day, this is a matter of individual aesthetic preference. Everyone is going to have different ideas on where the line should be drawn here. Moving the line in either direction from its current position is always going to meet resistance and upset someone (or upset those who want it moved if you don't move it).

[WhatMG]

Don't have too much new to say, but it's probably good to add my voice
I'd like to see the contributor reward removed and reworked into something else minor. 

I'm also not very fond of the non-standard names being used, myself. I've just felt that it doesn't fit particularly well. People have the title of doctor in real life, but that's because they're a doctor of some sort - Or pretending to be one, anyways. I've been called doctor plenty of times in game without having to change part of my character's name. I'm not fond of cyborg bioshell stuff, too, but that's for a largely unrelated borg-weirdness issues.

[Zamujasa]

I'm also not very fond of the non-standard names being used, myself. I've just felt that it doesn't fit particularly well. People have the title of doctor in real life, but that's because they're a doctor of some sort - Or pretending to be one, anyways.

i'm not sure how this is any different from someone putting it in as their name since we do not (and likely shouldn't) have a space for titles

[Lord_earthfire]

those people can make their opinions known instead of being maybe spoken for by you [...]

Oh, it wasn't meant to be only me speaking for others. It's an opinion i myself have and that i have also read from others on the discord and also partially saw on this thread. It was just meant to be a kind of try to summerize a position that causes some pushback within this thread that i myself share.

personally i enjoy playing this game with a cast of somewhat recognizable, visually-distinct people; i am not here to play, and do not want to play, with a bunch of visually-similar NPCs, or to even think of other players as "random numbers"; and even then, nothing stops a HoP or whoever from demoting / promoting people. if you can't do that because someone looks too interesting, that's a big skill issue on your part.

There is a middle ground between a grey corporate drone and everyone trying to be a main character and one-of-their-kind. And people manage to create recognizeable and distinct characters via behaviour, hair, speech, backstory and clothing. It would be sad if it wouldn't be possible. It's not that it's not impossible to play along with the real whacky characters, quite the contrary, but it's that it sticks out in a way that doesn't quite fit. It's a small gripe, after all.

At the end of the day, this is a matter of individual aesthetic preference. Everyone is going to have different ideas on where the line should be drawn here. Moving the line in either direction from its current position is always going to meet resistance and upset someone (or upset those who want it moved if you don't move it).

Yeah, i feel that summerizes this best.

[Glamurio]

I'm also not very fond of the non-standard names being used, myself. I've just felt that it doesn't fit particularly well. People have the title of doctor in real life, but that's because they're a doctor of some sort - Or pretending to be one, anyways.

i'm not sure how this is any different from someone putting it in as their name since we do not (and likely shouldn't) have a space for titles

Maybe a bit of a more nuanced take from me, I actually DO think we should have spaces for titles. I like titles as a rule, what I don't like is people misusing a space / feature that the game gave you for something else. This is kind of the same reason I don't like people using floating hair pieces as "elf ears", not because I don't think those would be cool, but rather because I'm just... unable to see past it for what it is, floating hair bits.

Their first name being "Dr." maybe shouldn't bug me, but does, because it's NOT their name, it's a title. Having a way to add a title (even if it's just a simple drop down between "Dr." or "Prof." or even "Mr.") and have that just also be displayed would be my preferred solution. But this is a tangent anyway.

[Zamujasa]

as a last-ditch attempt to salvage something good out of this, would a compromise in allowing this on classic and not rp be adequate? because i am going to feel real fuckin bad if this ends up effectively disabling a few friends' fun gimmicks.

Maybe a bit of a more nuanced take from me, I actually DO think we should have spaces for titles. I like titles as a rule, what I don't like is people misusing a space / feature that the game gave you for something else. This is kind of the same reason I don't like people using floating hair pieces as "elf ears", not because I don't think those would be cool, but rather because I'm just... unable to see past it for what it is, floating hair bits.

flatly: i cannot relate to this at all.

[Kotlol]

I'd say test merge it on classic for round start.
Not on RP yet.

Or make it a "trait" of a new human sub race.. like uuhm.. "Gelatinous humans" Slime humans like?
But give them their own stats and make have slime sounds if they get punched...

Maybe that would be more salvagable? Cause now it ain't a full on human, but a colorfull slime humanoid. (just spitballin' here)

[KikiMofo]

I'm pretty sure no one on Classic is going to care about weirdly colored humans. Go for it.

[Lord_earthfire]

as a last-ditch attempt to salvage something good out of this, would a compromise in allowing this on classic and not rp be adequate? because i am going to feel real fuckin bad if this ends up effectively disabling a few friends' fun gimmicks.

Oh yeah, on classic that fits well enough. That's a great idea.