[CLOSED PR] Reverts botany harvest nerf and tweaks produce satchels instead

[github_bot]

PULL REQUEST DETAILS




[BALANCE] [HYDROPONICS]
About the PR
Reverts c0c9958 and instead removes the ability to quickly pull individual items out of produce satchels.


Why's this needed?
The original change was made to nerf water-potassium/seething tomato spam, but also removes one of the more unique aspects of botany: delayed reactions.
This change affects seething tomatoes as well, reducing the possibility to easily chain stun someone with near-infinite tomato spam from a massive produce satchel, while retaining the ability to splice interesting delayed reactions.

Changelog

Code:

changelog
(u)LeahTheTech
(+)Botany produce no longer triggers reactions on harvest.
(+)You can no longer quickly remove single items from a produce satchel.

PULL REQUEST DETAILS

[Zamujasa]

I have already extensively argued about why I don't like this, but to be blunt:

- The delayed reactions, while neat, seem to be a niche utility solely for making stuff like murder tomatoes. There does not seem to be many other instances where this leads to anything notable. It also bypasses the normal method of doing these kinds of things (potassium + ice)
- This is one of the few game systems where reagents very specifically do not react. The change this reverts makes that consistent with other things.
- This makes satchels no longer congruent with one another; why is the produce satchel now the only one incapable of this? How does it make any sense in a logical perspective? "Sorry, I can't grab something out of my bag without dumping all of it on the floor."

"Grabbing a single item out of a produce satchel" has a lot of legitimate use cases and it's something I do frequently when I'm a botanist -- not just for produce, but for keeping and managing seeds. This fundamentally destroys all of that just so we can keep in a "funny" interaction that has been run into the ground in the last several days by being used to depopulate stations by maybe, hopefully making it harder to mass-murder with them.

I am strongly against this.



Edit: To make it even more blunt and unhappy, I don't think we should require botanists to create right-click crash piles of produce to sort through their shit because of a handful of people who just can't help themselves.

[mintyphresh]

I don't like this either-- I don't have much more to add than what Zamu said, but if I had to choose between potwater tomatoes and having an easy-to-use UI, I'd choose having a good UI.

[JOELED]

Really don't like this idea. Like Zamu said, produce satchels are an important tool for managing seeds. This is a really odd way to handle the problem it seems like it's intended to try and fix. Why make regular botany tools way worse to use to make people not use bomb plants as much? You can still fill boxes with them and have 30 or 50 or whatever bomb plants in your inventory like people did with the mini o2 bombs before they were nerfed.

[cheekybrdy]

I'm against this for a reason which hasn't been brought up, and that's the ranch.

Ranchers who use produce satchels for inventory optimisation would be punished for doing this, when quantity amounts for the eggs that this could be a concern about being more of skill expression then a active issue (could be different for RP egg quantities however given they normally go to 90). Considering ranch's lack of popularity within powergaming I REALLY don't think it needs this indirect nerf.

[Kotlol]

Second bad botanist PR... this week.

What's going on?

[Zamujasa]

Part of the problem is that a few people were mass-producing potassium-water seething tomatoes and basically obliterating everybody with them, because one throw disorients, the second throw stuns, and then you're locked in place until you die, and the tomatoes gib you on top of that.

The original change was inspired directly by it, as most nerfs are.

[Lord_earthfire]

I agree with Zamujasa there.

Prodice satchel picking up single items is a far too important aspect to working with produce in general. The functionslity is used for e.g. managing different seeds, chicken feed, food in the kitchen and others.

Among this, there is other throwable botany produce that will become completely useless by this change, most notably bowling melons.

I don't think pot/ice tomatoes were that fun/important to warant a clobbering on botany's most important tools.

Beyond that, i was thinking about a nerf like jass did. The idea had been to introduce a gene strain, which made the produce inert, as a way to get the old behaviour. I think sonething like that would be a more interesting approach to bring bsck such an interaction.

[TDHooligan]

you could make gene strains add liquids after harvest. then you can also use it to give players an option to pre-mix their plants, and additionally disable the shit potice stuff.

[LeahTheTech]

Oookay, I thought this would be way less disruptive but I'm not particularly attached to the idea. Will close.

[meaow589]

I don’t agree with this it make botanist work harder just because tomato