Traits to get you into medbay more.

[Kotlol]

Like many debates on the forums... one most well known is Medbay not getting enough patients or RP. People just walk in get healed or heal themselves then run out..
Doctors barely keep a patient for a minute before they fly out.
No scenerios like Scrubs or ER or Grey's Anatomy...
Heck we don't even have X-ray machines!

And people keep suggesting ways to "nerf" medbay to get interaction going and more doctoring to happen. (Example: the recent cloner nerf's)
...And to me... that just makes people turn away from medbay and doctoring.
You don't keep nerfing doctoring to get people to do more doctoring, it only makes it more confusing and make people less willing to pick up the job.

And we cannot force people into medbay with events or other things as it will just disrupt them too heavily... Forcing players to go to medbay only puts stress on doctors and most players sit in medbay and wait to be treated... and just like in real life.. not much happens till you get treated.

So with the premise of this post set. I recommend we do something else completely.
More traits that can put you into medbay... as these are VOLUNTAIRY (unless it's a cloner mishap)

We currently have things like Allergies that increases doctoring, but these are traits you can put on your charater by choice.
So why not add more?
I already made a small list of ideas:

- Immune comprimised (You get easily sick and things like the common cold will do damage to you and can kill you.)
- Hypercondria (Not sure how to do this one in a fun way)
- Xeno-touched (You just had to touch that unknown alien huh? Welp, enjoy whatever happen to your body! (random damage/organ damage over time) )
- Organ Donor (You are known as an organ donor, doctors love you, you get a lil extra cash, but when needed, doctors will take your organs for their patents)
- Puritan + or Cybernetic incompatiable (Cybernetics just don't work for you, if organs fail, you need donor organs or donor limbs (Or synethic organs/limbs)
- True Slob (You are already of poor hygiene, but when you start being smelly, you somehow start developing all kinds of diseases. (Diseases only effect this player)
- Viral Breeding Ground (You don't know why... but sometimes you just get sick despite everything.)

And that's my idea to increase doctoring.
Just introduce traits that people can select for their charaters (or added to being cloned too much) and people will be more willing to go to medbay.

Discuss away, rename things, change things. I don't mind. I just think traits are a better idea then nerfing doctoring.

[Cal]

I don't think this is a terrible idea, my only issue is people take things like this and act like medical NEEDS to cater to them, Puritan already has (though way less now) people screaming that they were cloned and exploded or whatever.

[Kotlol]

I don't think this is a terrible idea, my only issue is people take things like this and act like medical NEEDS to cater to them, Puritan already has (though way less now) people screaming that they were cloned and exploded or whatever.

That is one of the problems with Puritans. Incompitent doctors leads to their deaths. It's why I didn't suggest another full on puritan trait that can lead to permadeath.
(Well I did call one puritan +, but that's just a naming problem)

I do know this is litterly the number one problem with getting traits like puritan/allergies. Medbay has to figure it out. It puts pressure on only medbay, not the player who took it since they CHOSE TO.

It's not a perfect way to get people to spend more time in medbay... cause well doctors will be more pressured wich can turn em off from playing.
But at the very least... it's not nerfing medbay wich makes the whole station suffer under it. Wich sprouted my idea.

Though some of these "beta" traits have permanent fixes.
Xeno-touched for example gets fixed by introducing cyborg organs to them. (As long as they don't have another trait)
Then with enough food you can heal off the minor damage ticks and your organs won't take damage.

[Lord_earthfire]

Discuss away, rename things, change things. I don't mind. I just think traits are a better idea then nerfing doctoring.

While i like the idea of traits, i heavily disagree with that assessment. But i also think medbay does not need nerfs to their main healing task of the 4 damage types, more in what is around that and busted as hell (like the cryopod and cloner changes, which i appreciate a lot. People are still sleeping on cloning records).

You got these traits. But what will they change in general? Organ damage? Surgeries are easier and faster than chem healing. Diseases? Thanks to the hell that is disease code, you either cannot contain diseases within the population or heal them with a single chem injection.

What they have in common is, maybe except for surgeries, they don't make people deviate from their plan. They are problems medbay got the solutions for. What makes people stop and talk with the doctors is if the problem is not directly apparent or hard to solve. Like a cyberpancreas you got while you are allergic to sugar. Or mutations. Or being drunk and poisoned (i love the antihol recipe). Or a ricin and mirabilis mix in a person.

Treating the problem is not the problem. Finding it, the anamnesis, should be a problem as well. And most QOL of doctors make this very, very hard to implement.

Traits can deliver this as well. But only if the systems support that. Here are some things i have in mind.

Overstimulating mind: stimulating chems (synap, meth, epi, coffee) have a greater effect on your stamina. However, adding too many stimulants (2+) causes brain damage (higher than synaps healing).

The cure to handle it is mannitol. But it's a non-expectet difficulty that is added by doctors stacking chems ir randomly appearing.

Aldehyde hydrogenase deficiency (give it a fancy name for an overdrive of the alcohol flush syndrome): overdosing on alcohol causes an acetaldehyd buildup as well.

This causes doctors a bit more headaches since suddenly you have alcohol intoxication stacking with burn damage.

Purgative resistance: flusher chems (calomel, hunchback, pent acid, haloperidol, smelling salts) work only with 33% effectivity.

This makes you resistant to getting your stims drained, but makes getting poisoned much more worse. Suffering less damage from calomel is nice while healing less from pent acid is bad. And ricin is even more a death sentence than it already would be.

[Kotlol]

Discuss away, rename things, change things. I don't mind. I just think traits are a better idea then nerfing doctoring.

While i like the idea of traits, i heavily disagree with that assessment. But i also think medbay does not need nerfs to their main healing task of the 4 damage types, more in what is around that and busted as hell (like the cryopod and cloner changes, which i appreciate a lot. People are still sleeping on cloning records).

You got these traits. But what will they change in general? Organ damage? Surgeries are easier and faster than chem healing. Diseases? Thanks to the hell that is disease code, you either cannot contain diseases within the population or heal them with a single chem injection.

What they have in common is, maybe except for surgeries, they don't make people deviate from their plan. They are problems medbay got the solutions for. What makes people stop and talk with the doctors is if the problem is not directly apparent or hard to solve. Like a cyberpancreas you got while you are allergic to sugar. Or mutations. Or being drunk and poisoned (i love the antihol recipe). Or a ricin and mirabilis mix in a person.

Treating the problem is not the problem. Finding it, the anamnesis, should be a problem as well. And most QOL of doctors make this very, very hard to implement.

Traits can deliver this as well. But only if the systems support that. Here are some things i have in mind.

Overstimulating mind: stimulating chems (synap, meth, epi, coffee) have a greater effect on your stamina. However, adding too many stimulants (2+) causes brain damage (higher than synaps healing).

The cure to handle it is mannitol. But it's a non-expectet difficulty that is added by doctors stacking chems ir randomly appearing.

Aldehyde hydrogenase deficiency (give it a fancy name for an overdrive of the alcohol flush syndrome): overdosing on alcohol causes an acetaldehyd buildup as well.

This causes doctors a bit more headaches since suddenly you have alcohol intoxication stacking with burn damage.

Purgative resistance: flusher chems (calomel, hunchback, pent acid, haloperidol, smelling salts) work only with 33% effectivity.

This makes you resistant to getting your stims drained, but makes getting poisoned much more worse. Suffering less damage from calomel is nice while healing less from pent acid is bad. And ricin is even more a death sentence than it already would be.

Now these help a lot and make problems more complex. As I said I just put in some beta ideas to keep it simple then you are suggesting. I do like these traits that basicly go: "You get a buff here, but a DOWNGRADE here!"

Since most traits are just: "Upgrade here" or "Downgrade here"
with a few racial traits being: "Upgrades here, downgrades here." and being "Goofy humanoid"

I think these traits will not only spice up medbay interactions, but also spice up how to play your charaters... a perfect win win.
Even if negative traits gives people more + points to spend on benefical traits. (Cept Pugs)

[Zamujasa]

I don't think this is a terrible idea, my only issue is people take things like this and act like medical NEEDS to cater to them, Puritan already has (though way less now) people screaming that they were cloned and exploded or whatever.

honestly someone convince me not to give the death confetti effect to people when they puritan gib

well, maybe not when it's a ~cloner defect~ since that's not really funny or fair, just a fuck you

[Petey]

A diabetic trait might be interesting. Considering medical sits on insulin that I've rarely, if ever, seen used.

[ImJustAStrangeMan]

If puritan doctors have no responsibility to bring you back IMO.

[Lord_earthfire]

honestly someone convince me not to give the death confetti effect to people when they puritan gib

well, maybe not when it's a ~cloner defect~ since that's not really funny or fair, just a fuck you

I would really love to see the confetti effect on puritan gibs. But i think that is more encouraging to you.

Then again, if someone would scream at me for puritan cloning them: I would try to clone them again, out of spite. So maybe i am not the best person to take ideas from.

[Mouse]

I don't think this is a terrible idea, my only issue is people take things like this and act like medical NEEDS to cater to them, Puritan already has (though way less now) people screaming that they were cloned and exploded or whatever.

honestly someone convince me not to give the death confetti effect to people when they puritan gib

well, maybe not when it's a ~cloner defect~ since that's not really funny or fair, just a fuck you

do clown puritans get double confetti

edit: honestly if you don't clone puritans until you fail to get them into the scanner in time or they set DNR i feel like you're playing doctor wrong

[Kotlol]

A diabetic trait might be interesting. Considering medical sits on insulin that I've rarely, if ever, seen used.

You can still get pancreas failure. Wich does the same thing.
I believe diabetic was in the game in some point, but that was before I joined.

It was posted somewhere on the forums a few months ago as well as a reminder that it was removed due to bad behaviour.
I am just paraphrazing.

But we can also just come up with "Terminally Ill" traits of our own besides diabetic.

Maybe something like "Wormhole Sickness/Cryo Sickness" (A rare condition where the average spaceman suffers from complications after traveling to a station.)

[Meggal Bozale]

I don't know about RP, but on classic players will ALWAYS take the shortest route. Such a route is typically ignoring any doctors in medbay and dashing for the nearest burn healer (the yellow things, easily enough), because you KNOW you have burn damage after walking on the floor scanner that TELLS YOU what's wrong. The doctor requires sitting there awkwardly as they figure it out and get the right tool for the job, if they know what it is, and trusting them enough to administer the treatment in time to save you from dying in crit. Not to forget cryo, which is an easily accessible all-around healer.

Hell, going to medbay might not even be an option depending on how badly you're dying. And when that's the case, there's a good chance that it's going to take more than a defib and brute/burn automenders to get you on your feet, and the doctor won't drag you to medbay in time. And if they DO, it's easier to just clone scan you than go through the trouble of remedying the damage you took en route. But that's more of a problem with cloning, IMO.

I think the best solution to get people into medbay more (and to doctors, specifically) is to make it THE source of 'easy' healing, and to make it easier to stabilize patients. Currently, being below -100% health gives you a chance to outright die based on a number of factors. This is fine, but there's currently no way to reduce this to 0, instead it is only lowered with synap/atro combo or being in cryo. ..And it doesn't even lower the death chance from brain damage! Brain damage gives a much higher % chance for death than your regular health combined. 5% * brain damage, and you rack up a good amount in crit. Just 20 puts you to the cap of a 99% chance! (If I read it right, but i tested and mannitol gets a patient MUCH deeper into crit. the trio is best, even. But you can still die at 200 toxin damage, a common number to hit for bad poisons, if not lower.)

Instead of making crit stabilization something you need difficult and, frankly, annoying to insert chems for, I think doctors should have a status effect they can apply when interacting with a patient in crit to temporarily prevent a patient from dying. Spitballing numbers, but getting a hot mintue of this buff for the patient could give all doctors a good chance to figure out what's wrong with the patient and treat them accordingly. Though, this probabily shouldn't work outside of -300 to -400%, to prevent people failing to die despite ridiculous amounts of damage. So that can help get people into medbay alive, but what about treating them?

To give doctors another little something for treating patients, I also think it should be more difficult to treat these problems outside of medbay. More problems like mentioned that have an ongoing *cause* to the damage, not just the leftover caved in skull from getting bashed on the head with a toolbox. A styphic band-aid should be the hold-over for medbay, not the replacment for doctoring.

If you're feeling really bold, I say replace the cloner with some bed you can use to revive people. Like SR, but you have to be in medbay and treat ALL the patient's issues. Would get doctors busy in rounds where people are dead anywhere! Bit of a long post, but I have a lot to say on doctoring since it's still my favorite job.

TL;DR Let doctors prevent people dying in crit so they can sort stuff out, make healing in medbay the easiest option, and have first aid not be the last aid needed.

[Kotlol]

TL;DR Let doctors prevent people dying in crit so they can sort stuff out, make healing in medbay the easiest option, and have first aid not be the last aid needed.

I believe it's been suggested before that doctors should get "Specific" traits to do their job.
Similiar to how Engineers can deconstruct and build multiplue things at once or Security's training trait.

Not the surgery trait naturally.. but something that makes their healings faster.
And this "outta crit" thing isn't a bad idea either. As it's not a nerf but a buff for doctors being doctors. For calling doctors.

I am completely fine with buffing doctors so people have a reason to seek em out in classic.
Heck buff the chaplain's healing too while at it with a trait called: "Super Devout" (though the downside is certain chems, food or drinks will be considered poison to you and eating/drinking/taking those chems will cause brain damage. This is randomly selected.)

Jokes aside. I do think a trait when rolling doctor to prevent people from dieing to crit is a smart buff that doesn't change the status quo of using things, but gives more reason for doctors to do their job... THAT SAID...

My topic wasn't ment to give doctors a reason to exist.. but a reason for doctors to interact more with patients and use different chems/treatments without nerfing medbay or forcing players to stay in medbay longer without their choice.

This idea of new traits is ment to get you into medbay more cause "you got something that cannot be cured by just mending it away."
Your idea is to give doctors more meaning in classic as they can stablize patients, wich is admirable too! I think it should be added, but it doesn't change what the doctors have to do to cure someone. The interaction remains the same. Mend, Toxins, stablize, Mannitol/Mutadone.

That's where our suggestions go in opposite ways. 
I recommend putting up your own suggestion on this as it's too good to leave it out to rot if my suggestion doesn't pick up more pace. 

Explain how you want to apply this "Outta crit" buff to doctors and trust me. People will 5 star it.

[Soleil]

I want the deathwish trait to be pickable (doubles all brute and burn damage you take)