Complaint the system has failed

[tabachi]

"I'm going to save you from whatever tantrum you're looking to make and just locking this since you don't appear to actually be interest in appealing this and instead just looking to complain about another player."

This is just insulting.

The whole reason I made the ban appeal was not to complain about a player. it was the FAILURE of this system. I wanted to know why a person who broken several RP rules, who i ahelped in the moment has no consequence, and I, who broke a borg rule in the last three minutes, am punished for it. The admins literally just rewarded a trollish player for breaking the rules and abusing the report system.

I'm a supportive player of this game. I'm often in prerounds telling people to read rules. I engage in friendly conversation on the discord server, in-game i drop what i'm doing to help teach new players how to use their hands.

The outright lack of concern and disrespect i get is just hurtful.

I want to quit this game because of the admin conduct, from enacting a ban with ZERO investigation into what happened, to telling me I'm having a "tantrum" when I've been wording everything as calmly and eloquently as I can.

I was hoping to learn enough to be a mentor one day to help players, and get involved in the community.

Now I just feel worthless because you refuse to investigate or even acknowledge my concerns about this failure here. These rules are here to protect me, and instead, a troll used them to get me banned. This system has failed.

I might be emotional at the moment, but considering how much i want to support the community and the outright rude behavior i get from admins i deal with... i very much want to quit this game.

[Stush]

I just want to reply to this saying that Tabachi is a good person, and they're only so upset that they feel that things were applied unfairly, i wasn't there so i can't really talk with authority but please don't hold this against them.

Admin edit: Please do not post to feedback threads which do not directly involve you

[Mrfishstick]

You violated a server rule and were punished accordingly, this is the system working as intended.

The actions of another player do not impact the above in any way shape or form. You are hopping up and down yelling the "system has failed" because an admin did not immediately ban a player you were currently upset with and furthermore, our failure to inform you we have done so is ostensibly "rewarding a troll". What I can tell you is that at the time you sent in your adminhelp, multiple admins were online at the time and reviewed your entire interaction with the "troll player" over the entire round and after discussing it amongst themselves and reviewing server logs, took multiple moderative actions. Among those actions taken was to place a 24 hour ban on your account given your prior history of escalating beyond the limitations of server rules when another player upsets you. Additional actions where taken but given our long standing policy of not discussing moderation actions taken against third parties, I can not elaborate beyond that.

If you feel this represents a failed system I'm not really sure what additional assurances I can offer here. Multiple staff were online and reviewed events using all information available at hand and took what they felt were appropriate steps in response to what they found. That you disagree with their findings is entirely your progragative but will not ultimately impact the outcome. A player's "standing in the community" or "desire to become a mentor" while potentially laudable, do not shield a player from the consequences of rule violations or grant them special insights into the moderation actions taken against another player.

[tabachi]

"You are hopping up and down yelling"

Is a little bit of respect and humanity too much to ask for?

At the end of the day, i don't care about a 24 hour ban. I feel like admins dislike me themselves, and thus let things slide when unlikeable rule breakers outright harass me to ruin my experience. I am overly, disproportionately judged when i do anything. What assurances I have that this is fair? Because given the minor rude jabs that come out at me in almost every interaction i've had with an Admin (that wasn't on discord,) i'm feeling there's a lot of contempt for me, and it doesn't make these responses trustworthy.

At the end of the day, you are driving me to quit this game and quit the community simply because you refuse to respect me as a person. From what I can see, the admin behavior on my case has been dismally poor.

I'm hurt because i thought you guys understood how to deal with people and situations professionally.

---

The real irony is after that round, I didn't want to play for a few days. I honestly feel like you guys hate me and did this to me out of contempt. That's how i feel about it. It doesn't feel clean at all. It's sloppy.

I won't quit but i might be gone for a week or more.

I'm sorry for whatever it was i did to make your lives harder.

[Caro]

Hi, as I'm the banning admin, I'd like to address the feedback post aswell.
First of all, I'd like you to know that I do not assume you're acting in bad faith, and I do understand that the whole situation sparkled some negative emotions in you. But, I do feel both the ban appeal and the admin feedback posts of yours contain a fair bit of misleading information and a lot of unnecessary accusations.
I have read through the logs from the round you got banned for several times now, and, with that knowledge, I'm going to go through the ban appeal first (this one: https://forum.ss13.co/showthread.php?tid=17415)

First off, the laws were changed towards the end of the round. I may have been free to act as I did, I honestly do not know. In the discord chat after the round, there was indeed a law change. This should be considered.

There was no law change at any point into the round.

He targeted me for harassment. He stalked me every moment from there on out, assaulting me, running through any location I was at and causing trouble there, all with zero RP, spamming "flips you off" emote, not talking. the few times he did talk was to insult me.
This player seemed to target me and harass me with the intent on getting me to break my laws, and then report me.

From what I could read in the round logs, the player you accused of targeted harrasment interacted with you only once. They chairflipped at you and used the "flips off" emote (Again, once, there was no emote spam involved). There were no verbal insults involved in the speech logs at all. After that, you proceeded to chase them, bolt doors to catch them, complain about them on the radio, ask for permission to kill them, and, in the end, you ended up slashing them with a circular saw. All of it, on default AI laws.

Now, when it comes to admin conduct, there's a lot of context we take into account when dealing with ahelps. We look through player stats, notes, we read through the logs. We tend to be more lenient towards new players, as they often don't know any better, unlike the regulars.
A player you accused of harrasment and decided to attack was new. They were talked to about their conduct during the round.
When I looked into your notes though, I noticed you already have been tempbanned + warned in the past, for going out of your way and targeting another player because they inconvenienced you. This is why I decided to go for a ban, as this situation felt similar to me.

The system hasn't failed, I didn't reward anyone for trolling, the player's intention wasn't to bait you into attacking them. I did not apply a ban with zero investigation into what happened. The server rules aren't here to protect you, they're here to ensure every player can have fun in a RP friendly environment, not just you.

You broke the rules, as a player who should be familiar with them by now. You got banned for 24 hours. I don't personally think the punishment I applied was harsh at all.

[tabachi]

if I could point out something no admins considered (or have probably noticed) All players I've had issues with i have eventually befriended in one way or another. I don't hold grudges. I'm very empathetic. I know when I'm being targeted by players intent on ruining someone's experience, which that player was. I feel like he was judged on his actions, which were tactically minimal, and not on his intent which was obvious and reprehensible. That should be addressed.

Thank you for the professional response.

---

shit, i didn't intend for the smiley, that was just the close parenthesis

[Leeanei]

We cannot determine intent from a two actions in a single round, but we can determine your intent from everything you did to make that player's round worse. You took the slimmest opportunity to get enraged and griefed a brand new player. That's not at all okay. If you want to talk about "intent which was obvious and reprehensible", it was yours. As a long time player you should know better and and have built up tolerance to the actions of your other players, particularly minor ones like this.