Let's talk about Antag Captains

[Froggit_Dogget]

The people who pick Captain to powergame are generally just as happy to load up on sec gear and hunt "bad guys" with their laser gun when they don't get antag, and removing their chance to be an antag would just exacerbate this problem in a different way. ("Captains can't be antags, so I'm ordering you to open up the armory and give me all the gear in it, I can't be an antag so there's no way for me to misuse it")

If anyone tried this, if there was any competant sec on the captain would be ridiculed and kicked out of sec.

[Drewmajor11]

I like antag captains on main but I'm ok with their gear being limited and removing them from being able to be spies.

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The people who pick Captain to powergame are generally just as happy to load up on sec gear and hunt "bad guys" with their laser gun when they don't get antag, and removing their chance to be an antag would just exacerbate this problem in a different way. ("Captains can't be antags, so I'm ordering you to open up the armory and give me all the gear in it, I can't be an antag so there's no way for me to misuse it")

If anyone tried this, if there was any competant sec on the captain would be ridiculed and kicked out of sec.

Also yes, I would pulse the captain out of the room if they tried this shit but a lot of the time competent security isn't around so that could end up happening.

[RGBDeadSilent]

I dunno, i've had some great shifts as a traitor Captain playing bad cop when HoS isn't around. Catch some folks, plant syndicate contraband on them, charge them with some crimes that equals out to corporate treason. Now the officers trust me, so I can send them on a vacation out the airlock. It can be good times and I'd hate to see it go. But Cap also comes with exactly what I abused on what I just said, Security influence.

The HoP has basically the same access, but the idea of the HoP just doesn't have a lick of security influence. In fact, SecHop is loathed nearly every time its seen. Someone who takes the HoP role and abuses it for access and equipment. If the HoP goes and starts to do shit like trying to control security, or grabbing security equipment, people are going to start raising some eyebrows. Most officers might even tell him to fuck off.

Meanwhile, if the Captain goes to cargo as a traitor, buys his own security crate, and dons a security belt and starts making his targets seem like valid syndicate agents, then there is a pretty fair chance someone is going to believe him. Hell, there are plenty of shifts where the only "Sec" is the Captain.

And sadly, when the only security on station is the Captain, and the Captain is a traitor it kinda either dooms the station, or sounds a war horn for valid hunters to step up to the plate.

If the Captain was limited on antagonist roles, I think it would make sense. Honestly, I think Ling should be able to be nearly every role, vampire too really. But I don't think the Captain should ever be a syndicate operative.

[Alexalmighty502]

I'm in favor of letting the captain roll antag. SS13 is all about the inability to trust others and I feel like the fact that almost everyone can be an antag including those in high places adds to the game rather than it being abused and hurting people's experiences. However, I believe both the cap and the hop shouldn't be able to roll spy thief (I also think that department heads shouldn't either but I expect most to disagree with this opinion). Their access gives them a bit too much of an edge compared to other spy thieves.

[Rlocks]

Personally, i feel like cap antags not being a thing would be good, since 99% the time (atleast, 99% the time before my hiatus), the cap antags were powergamers who rushed everything and silent rampaged, which probably tainted my experience with them. There probably are some who can do good gimmicks and such with the role and tools, but from my experience, they usually just silently rampage with the tools they get access to at roundstart.

[GORE]

We had this same thread just a couple of months ago.

Not feeling like repeating myself.

So Imma just state this.

Cap traitor = good traitor

[Katzen]

Despite my last reply I'm now leaning more towards the idea of captain traitors/mindslaves not being that healthy for the chain of command on main, resulting in HoS effectively being treated as the most senior role around due to their immunities.

[THISISANICEGAME]

Do we want captains to be taken seriously on main? I don't want to, it is funny having the role who is supposed to be at the top of the chain of command have no leadership and I don't want to take orders from the captain.

Also, on the HoS thing, ime the only real time I have to overrule the captain is when they start getting too much into sec's business and ordering executions left and right, I have never had an AI listen to me instead of the captain when we both asked for different stuff, point is, being the captain means as much as you make of it and get others to play into it, a captain that just vanishes and does their own thing has no leadership but a captain who has been doing gimmicks or whatever that the crew enjoys is much more trusted by the crew.

[BatElite]

As an aside, it's interesting how since the anti-mindslave implant got merged the HoS apparently became the practical authority of the station. That seems like a good change over "the first guy you mindslave".

(Don't really have an opinion on antag captains themselves, I don't experience them all that often)