Pod Wars Feedback Thread

[BatElite]

I've just participated in the second round of this, and I'm quite pleased with the whole thing, especially in how it combines the weird specificity and jank of goonstation mechanics with the simplicity of the "capture points and bonk the enemy team" formula.
 
I don't have that much to elaborate on the good stuff (I want to note that I'm pretty positive overall), but here's the issues I've had:

1: The whole thing lasts longer than it probably should. This round came in at 96 minutes total, and as I understand the first one was also very long. I thought that an NT vs SY gamemode would take maybe 45 mins at most. I skipped reading the whole scoring thing because I thought we had to rush like hell, but the scoring system seems to take quite some time and the 10k health pools for the critical systems are daunting.

2: Pod Wars requires knowledge of a lot of different game systems . Off the top of my head I can count:
-Mining in general, both how you do it and the matsci aspect (with the dinghy pods seemingly unable to mine?)
-What different
-Building pods (fairly rare in regular rounds)
-Controlling pods (not that hard but none of that shit is intuitive or has feedback)
-Some understanding of combat and meds, though not a lot

None of this is an issue for seasoned players, but I honestly have no idea how one would guide a complete newbie in that environment. Genuinely a throw-your-hands-up situation. I disagree with some of the others about different weapons and stuff, keeping the combat straightforward in favour of focusing on the teamwork aspects.

3: I'm sure this one is most easily fixed, but some stuff could really do with custom assets. We've had apparent issues with the syndie team friendly firing on the blue-with-red-flames syndie pods this round. The critical systems at the moment are disgusting to my snobby little spriter tastes, although they're pretty much fine as placeholders. Also a sound for one of your pod shots hitting something else is sorely needed in dogfights.

4: Minor thing but maybe the bases could do with some more robust lighting. As a syndie I noticed two of the dinghy fabs had lights on them and those would inevitably get removed by misclicks. In any case, some neons to outline some of the main geometry would be nice once stuff gets dark.

[nefarious6th]

I disagree with some of the others about different weapons and stuff, keeping the combat straightforward in favour of focusing on the teamwork aspects.

Couple of things because I forgot to mention it and liked an idea in here as well:

1.) I keep posting feedback/thoughts but I want to reiterate what Bat put so expertly here: this is a really fun gamemode, like probably my favorite! I don't mean to only pick and pick, this has been really great and I think is a super Goon Highlight

2.) I agree with the above sentiment from Bat! I think removing the CSabers was really good and maybe the guns could still use some thought but I really really like working together with friends using interchangeable weapons to just take people out on the fly. I can pick up whatever and know it's the same gear, it's plentiful and replaceable, and I can always loan spares or my stuff out to someone missing theirs. I also just don't particularly think adding some Big Flashy Weapons would be great because I think it would encourage solo I'm-The-Big-Hero mentality. I like it better when I can sit side-by-side with the commander and another player and defend the Bridge, versus people flying off to do their own thing because they're Mega Kitted and Robust

[coolvape]

the syndicate red flame pods would still look cool and unique if they had a black body instead of a blue one(and would be less confusing) - the NT blue flame pods are all blue, fitting their colors, red and black would work well for syndicate

more classes - maybe syndie/nt miners, syndie/nt mechanics/podsmiths, syndie/nt medics(maybe with a syringe gun you can fill with healchems?)

if those had toolbelts it would need to be sure that the pistols cannot fit in belts - the current biggest weakness of jetpacks is you can only carry a handful of items, changing that would just make the jetpack pistol meta stronger

making shotgun pod weapons cheaper would offer a straightforward counter to the jetpack meta, but maybe have them be worse against pods?

default pod weapons should probably be stronger so there's a reason to use them

the disruptor array(i think that's what it's called, the big one that shoots loud red shots) should more reliably destroy grilles, currently it's cool as hell and good against pods even if the dps sucks, but not being able to break grilles reliably despite destroying walls and windows makes it less interesting and powerful

fortuna is easily the best, most fun station to fight around - lots of doors and windows, it's well lit, it's a blast. in contrast, UVB is dark and somehow both spread out and claustrophobic - it's not super fun to fight around. Maybe if it had a chem dispenser and some lights(even if you had to deploy the lights), it'd be more fun. unsure.

[Sov]

cyrogen for people to log out inside of

[aloe]

Some thoughts on the mining:
1. Either give the space suits rad immunity, or create a miner role which is worse in combat stats but gets rad resist on their armor. Having to juggle indy armor sucks (and means you aren't representing your team fashion-wise), and getting mutations can kinda screw the balance of the mode- I saw two people in the last round roll fire resistance, which is just goofy. The fact that the chem dispensers are so jacked means radiation is never an actual issue, just a minor annoyance, and I don't see it adding anything to this mode.

2. Some kind of a shared storage for fabs would be very nice. I get the idea of having multiple fabs- speeds up printing ship/mining parts- but as is everyone just shoves all the mats in one, and as a result that's the only fab that gets used. Another issue was that with the amount of fabricators around the ship (including the medical, genfab, and nanofabs, 10?) I would oftentimes have to check the storage on every one to make sure nobody had shoved a stack of bohrum somewhere obscure and forgotten about it. Organization breaks down VERY easily (if it was ever there in the first place), so some system to distribute mats between fabs automatically would make things much smoother. Thinking about it a bit more, it also felt like the reclaimers always went missing- maybe having an anchored material processor in mining which sent the ores to some space-bullshit-magic-ore-storage would work.

3. Less useless ores. There's nothing (to my knowledge) that you can actually do with gold, syreline, or cobryl, outside of using them as last-ditch fabricator fuel, and there were a TON of these kinds of ores in both magnet asteroids and the ones scattered around. I get that that's part of mining- not everything you find is useful- but with the massive material requirements of this mode, I think the spawn rates for stuff like bohrum, mauxite, and pharosium should be adjusted upwards a bit. Also, the need for telecrystals for so many higher-tier items (and grenades) is a bit odd, considering how random they are to find.

Overall, mining feels pretty rewarding to me. The insane material costs of higher tier pods, jetpacks, etc mean that you're always busy, and you have to stay on your toes to avoid getting shot by passing pods. Still, the overall lack of organization can be painful, and I'd love some QoL changes to make things run a bit smoother.

Also, there isn't really a... I don't know what to call it, so let's say "power curve" with mining in this gamemode. It doesn't feel like, at 75+ minutes in, we're dueling with more powerful stuff than at 15 minutes. In fact, in the 1 round I played, we ran out of decent materials around 45 minutes and just never got more. and we WON! The whole framework of mining isn't really built to support a slow ramp up in stuff you find and stuff you can build, but I think it would be more interesting if mining could obtain some things at, say, 45 minutes, that they couldn't before. Give them something to work towards rather than 'stick mats in fab -> person builds hi-tech pod -> go get more mats'. Maybe put some nanite asteroids around the map that people would have to gear up to mine, or increase the amount of good materials closer to the center of the map so you can work towards stronger equipment to be able to mine in the more dangerous areas. I think mining in regular rounds has this problem as well, but it's exacerbated in a round which is both longer and more combat-focused.

[Eagletanker]

Alright.

So, first round of pod wars. If there's one thing to take away from this. WE NEED ORGANIZATION IN SOME SHAPE OR FORM PLEASE!

So, mining was a big bottle neck, namely smelting and collection, along with fabs. in order to fix this, I suggest making ores insta smelt, and when they are picked up by a pod/human with a special scooper only on pod wars, they get sent to one big pool of mat's. This can be used by any fab to make anything. Also, a dedicated logistics squad should be added in. Seriously. We need SeaBees, whose main job is repair, building, then overhauling pods, mining, and fortification. Make 8 of them on each side and they get their own radio. They should have a foreman or something too, so they can coordinate their actions with the commander. Along with this, more buildables should be added and barricades should be nerfed a bit. Less health, and gun fire should effect it. Add in buildable turrets and emplacements, along with prefab FoBs which act as a warp point and a general hold out location. Each team gets two, and they should have to be deployed at least 100 m away from each other and the cap points. They can get built up by SeaBees, and if they are destroyed, are a massive blow to points for what ever side lost it. Along with that, make capture points gain points slower and destruction of critical systems count to points. Each ship should also be redesigned to be more carrier like, with one side for pods to come in and another out so traffic jams dont happen, with bays for building pods. the Dingys should be heavily slowed down in spawn time, with around each fab making one every 3 minutes or so. I'll get to why later...

Also, control points should be the general zone of where weapons and stuff should land. This way, it's not a constant slog heavily leaning to one side all the time as they get regular shipments of gear which is constantly better. Rushing should also be heavily toned down though I dont know how. Which brings to a quick note about the meta and what it will become. As is, its better to get a bigger power cell, and rush with a prefab pod. Take a control point, and then you hold it. The Fortuna is also too much of the point to hold. If you take Fortuna, your going to hold it. Building pods is likely going to become a occasional thing, as taking a jetpack and duel wielding or just flying around with the dinghies is going to be more prevalent, as the mode becomes more and more based on speed especially once warp beacons are added. Rushing the Fortuna will also become meta, as it's your point to lose upon getting in it.

If theres anything to take away from this bit of feed back it's this

**ORGANIZATION AND CHAIN OF COMMAND WINS THE ROUND AND RIGHT NOW THE GAME SET UP TO DISCORAGE THAT**

My suggestion? Squadrons. 8 people per squadron, with a leader. This leader has access to a general, squadron, and a Command radio. They also provide their squadron mates with a small buff to damage/health/stamina depending upon . The 7 others get a general and a squadron radio. Above them is the commander, who has access to the command and general radio. This commander can provide bigger buffs to damage/health/stamina, or have a special drone that allows them to see more of the field at any time. The Commander delegates orders to Squadrons who carry them out. There is also the SeaBees, who build, maintain, and improve pods and defenses. In exchange for having no pistol, they get a utility belt with a shield to take them out of danger for a bit, along with a high capacity welder. It takes them less time and mats to build a Pod, and their armour is rad resistant to help with mining. They should be repairing and building pods, with their leader coordinating to build defenses and the FoB's. They act as second line troops, and shouldn't fight. To join one of these, you should have posters around the ship, and you can chose a squadron there in the first 5 minutes. After this, your automatically placed in a squadron and given a radio. (with the exception of Seabees, who should always be able to be joined and no one should be forced to join it.) From there you follow the leader, and the commander commands the battle rather yelling into the void. Again, CoC and Organization is key. Syndies in the round I played lost organization in the first minute, and as such lost the game while NT kept it going longer, and ended up wining. The Ships should also have podbays designed more as a runway, like this -|v|- (the subtraction signs are maintaince/building bays) rather than the current conventional design. If these ships are like carriers, they should be designed as such. Remove the pets being killed counting as a win too, it's kinda a let down. If it goes over time, start a countdown from 5 minutes and shut off the cloners. Who ever has more people alive at the end wins.

(also as a adding to aloe, there is nano asteroids but they are few and far between and kinda useless)

---

Also progress. Make some big super weapon each side can build. Maybe take a look at "Cruisers"(they really should be more Patrol Boats) and how they work/are. Make them hard to take down and a thing you can concentrate on making/protecting/destroying. It should be a bit asymmetric for these superweapons aswell.

[Mouse]

3. Less useless ores. There's nothing (to my knowledge) that you can actually do with gold, syreline, or cobryl, outside of using them as last-ditch fabricator fuel, and there were a TON of these kinds of ores in both magnet asteroids and the ones scattered around. I get that that's part of mining- not everything you find is useful- but with the massive material requirements of this mode, I think the spawn rates for stuff like bohrum, mauxite, and pharosium should be adjusted upwards a bit. Also, the need for telecrystals for so many higher-tier items (and grenades) is a bit odd, considering how random they are to find.

Gold and cobryl can get smelted together in the arc smelter to get electrum, which is a high energy conductor like claretine.  Syreline is useless though.

[Katzen]

I want commanders to stand out more on the radio or maybe there should be some kind of announcement system so it's big and obvious when they are asking for people to attack/defend a certain point.

A map button in the top left would be great if it could give an ingame map that showed the overall situation and could have attack defend orders. Perhaps the commander should have a map table they can place markers on.

[Eagletanker]

Alright, second round played.

Rushing Fortuna is definitely going to the meta, as NT wasnt able to secure Fortuna at all during the round. Reliant changed hands twice, from syndie to Nt and back to syndie. Not building anything heavier than a fab pod also allowed for a faster rush.

This really needs to be changed imo, and it can be done by reducing cap points point give or a more depth focuesd appoach. I also noticed that Organization as Syndies was a better, which contributed to the win.

[nefarious6th]

Fourth round!
Was on NT; same problems with point balancing and capture; we held two points for about 20/30 minutes and still were net losing points overall, and held one but actually got to a point where our overall points stagnated totally at Zero and we weren't earning anything at all. Reliant was played smart by SY and flip flopped, UBV we held for most the round. Fortuna...yeah. Round actually ended at 60 minutes with SY captures of all three.

We also had so many AFK/Disconnected players on NT that the commander said it was pretty much 2v1 for us by about minute 35.

Last thing that happened was at minute 8 BEFORE the radstorm shields dropped one of our critical systems was destroyed in one shot, as we only got a single message in chat that it was Destroyed, not that it was under attack, which means something hit it and did 10k or more damage. That set us 40 points behind, and there didn't seem to be any SY people around it. No idea what that was about?

[GORE]

Fourth round!
Was on NT; same problems with point balancing and capture; we held two points for about 20/30 minutes and still were net losing points overall, and held one but actually got to a point where our overall points stagnated totally at Zero and we weren't earning anything at all. Reliant was played smart by SY and flip flopped, UBV we held for most the round. Fortuna...yeah. Round actually ended at 60 minutes with SY captures of all three.

We also had so many AFK/Disconnected players on NT that the commander said it was pretty much 2v1 for us by about minute 35.

Last thing that happened was at minute 8 BEFORE the radstorm shields dropped one of our critical systems was destroyed in one shot, as we only got a single message in chat that it was Destroyed, not that it was under attack, which means something hit it and did 10k or more damage. That set us 40 points behind, and there didn't seem to be any SY people around it. No idea what that was about?

I have to comment on that.

While it is true that NT held UBV-67 for most of the round; I was there camping the pod-space around UBV-67 with my max-pod.
I killed at least a dozen people without dying once. People just kept arriving with emergency pods all the time and were easy picks.

Capturing points does not counter constantly dying to an unstoppable force. Which is fine IMO.

[nefarious6th]

Understandable but this has been a multi-round thing I have noticed despite holding positions for a relatively long period of time, even when the positions are stable (we were able to move people out of UVB to Reliant because we fortified and were done there).

I recognize dying loses points.

[Zafhset]

First round earlier today (same as the guys above)! It's a really fun game mode that could use tweaking.

I think it would be more fun if one of the target capture locations was more accessible to pod warfare as all the capture points follow the same formula of "use pod to drive there > maybe shoot a little > dismount and start infantry warfare inside"

Perhaps a capture point that was designed similar to the syndicate satellite in the debris field would work? it would encourage more extensive pod warfare to hold/capture that point.

[Katzen]

Drop ship pods that make infantry beacons to warp troops through? Would be hard to balance but there could be a good mechanism to get a troop push and have the other side need to focus on taking out the beacons.

[unfunnyperson]

For the love of god please make syndicate robust pod armor not blue. So many people including me thought pods using it were nt at the start and accidentally destroyed a teammates pod.