thoughts on bringing the 10 minute respawn timer to classic

[Zamujasa]

classic rounds tend towards 60 minutes on average (*ass pull statistic); a 10 minute timer makes you miss a solid chunk of that.

i'm not too concerned with modes like blob or flock. blob tends to build slow and every body the blob eats is a buff to its survivability, and 10 minutes is a loooong time on blob. Nuke sidesteps the issue by it just being long enough.


re: cloning and such, a lot of people say cloning makes death cheap but I still don't see it being used all that often on classic, especially because people love to blow it up first thing. it just sucks for everyone else when it's gone and they die 10 minutes in and now you can't do shit for an hour.

[valtsu0]

Definitely worth the testmerge. I also think we should experiment with diffrent respawn timers too, like 15 minutes

[KikiMofo]

Classic rounds are short and I don't see any improvement to rounds having a respawn.
I like the random antag respawning because that provides some flavor and chaos to the round but just having people pop outta the cryochamber ready to go after 10 minutes is kinda weird.
Id only be down for this if someone died within the first lets say 10 minutes of the round. Then they can respawn in another 10 minutes and its not too far into the round to be weird.

[Retrino]

really like this idea. not only is being stuck dead an entire round miserable, but its also a big deterrent to someone sticking around unless they already like the game enough to want to wait on another shift (or just find whatever is happening inround interesting to observe). it also seems like a decent counter to the station wiping antag gimmicks, and could promote a little more creativity with the shuttle hijack objective. rampage rounds, back when i played on classic majority of the time, took an awful toll on pop. if there was an option to respawn, and the general knowledge that respawning is a thing, it may lessen the likelihood of antags going on a murder spree on anything that moves, and in turn have more people waiting to get back into the shift.

the difficult thing i could see with this is more people not understanding the new character rule if theyre spam clicking through popups to get back into the round, assuming its just a free respawn. the game makes it pretty clear that youre supposed to pick a new one, but there may need to be some sort of other mechanical thing in place to keep people from rejoining on their same save slot

[Zamujasa]

there already is a basic check in place (it won't let you rejoin with the same name), because people do exactly that

[Glamurio]

there already is a basic check in place (it won't let you rejoin with the same name), because people do exactly that

tfw me dying as John Staffman only to come back 10 minutes later as John Staffman II, a totally distinct and unrelated individual

[Lord_earthfire]

there already is a basic check in place (it won't let you rejoin with the same name), because people do exactly that

tfw me dying as John Staffman only to come back 10 minutes later as John Staffman II, a totally distinct and unrelated individual

Ah, the dnd respawn-classic

[Ikea]

I think a respawn timer is worth testmerging that being said I think a ten minute respawn timer would hurt antags severely. A key part of classic (at least for me) is how some rounds can snowball out of control and a big reason for this is that crew oftentimes die at a higher rate then antags. Killing a security officer matters a lot less to a round if they can just come back as a staffie ten minutes later and fight you again. The game also doesnt like to add midround antags and this would probably need to be adjusted if this change went through.

Personally I think a respawn timer should be more focused on making sure that people who die early on don't have to wait 50 minutes, and as such it should be closer to 15/20 minutes long. If you die a half a hour in, a 20 minute respawn timer won't really help you, but if you die within the first ten minutes you still experience half of the round.

[Zamujasa]

I think a respawn timer is worth testmerging that being said I think a ten minute respawn timer would hurt antags severely. A key part of classic (at least for me) is how some rounds can snowball out of control and a big reason for this is that crew oftentimes die at a higher rate then antags. Killing a security officer matters a lot less to a round if they can just come back as a staffie ten minutes later and fight you again. The game also doesnt like to add midround antags and this would probably need to be adjusted if this change went through.

the word "just" is doing a lot of heavy lifting here; 10 minutes is a long time on classic, and someone going from sec to staff just to show up and fight the antag again would be a pretty clear violation of the "new life" rule

that siad, i don't know where you go tthe idea that the game "doens't like to add midround antags", it very frequently does, based on how many antags/crew are alive/dead

Personally I think a respawn timer should be more focused on making sure that people who die early on don't have to wait 50 minutes, and as such it should be closer to 15/20 minutes long. If you die a half a hour in, a 20 minute respawn timer won't really help you, but if you die within the first ten minutes you still experience half of the round.

if you die 20 minutes into a round and have to wait 20 minutes to respawn, you're effectively still sitting out half of a round -- you'd be getting in roughly around when the shuttle is being called. i don't think this makes it any better.

[BatElite]

I don't think it could hurt at all. Hopefully we'd get folks willing to risk a bit more too.

[Kotlol]

the word "just" is doing a lot of heavy lifting here; 10 minutes is a long time on classic, and someone going from sec to staff just to show up and fight the antag again would be a pretty clear violation of the "new life" rule

I may not play classic a lot but when I do... 10 mins is more the enough time for an antag to kill half a station if left unchecked. And mostly after that antag is dead.. the next one becomes a threat. And then the next one. Heck I once played a more passive antag (aka more misschief and lower crimes as well trying to do a bit) and constantly I get ignored cause... the job I am disguised under is constantly under fire from antags (not the medbay, it was the chapel)
A traitor planting a bomb next to my chapel... Welp gotta kill em. that's my base yer blowing up!
Blob infection? I guess I gotta kill it.
Kudzu growth from botany... guess I gotta burn it.
Flock shows up on the same spot the blob was. OH FOR THE LOVE OF...!
And this was all in a span of 32 minutes.

Respawns are fine, the only "REAL" downside I can see is people killing themselves on purpose so they can be mid-shift antags in 10 mins, but even that is not a huge problem. Since as you pointed out.. 10 mins a lot happens.
Only the 1st 10 mins is MOSTLY uneventful since everyone is preparing their stuff. (not always but that's the average time) but even that is silly.

10 mins is 100% fine.

[Ikea]

I think a respawn timer is worth testmerging that being said I think a ten minute respawn timer would hurt antags severely. A key part of classic (at least for me) is how some rounds can snowball out of control and a big reason for this is that crew oftentimes die at a higher rate then antags. Killing a security officer matters a lot less to a round if they can just come back as a staffie ten minutes later and fight you again. The game also doesnt like to add midround antags and this would probably need to be adjusted if this change went through.

the word "just" is doing a lot of heavy lifting here; 10 minutes is a long time on classic, and someone going from sec to staff just to show up and fight the antag again would be a pretty clear violation of the "new life" rule

It's not that people you killed will immediately chase you down, it's that you can't really take people out of a round with this change. Unless you kill someone in the last sixth of a round, they will respawn and then can go onto helping the station. It doesn't take long for a person to grab construction tools and begin repairing a hole, or join as doctor and begin healing people. It just makes the action of antags much more reversible because death is now much more impermanent.

[Glamurio]

I think a respawn timer is worth testmerging that being said I think a ten minute respawn timer would hurt antags severely. A key part of classic (at least for me) is how some rounds can snowball out of control and a big reason for this is that crew oftentimes die at a higher rate then antags. Killing a security officer matters a lot less to a round if they can just come back as a staffie ten minutes later and fight you again. The game also doesnt like to add midround antags and this would probably need to be adjusted if this change went through.

the word "just" is doing a lot of heavy lifting here; 10 minutes is a long time on classic, and someone going from sec to staff just to show up and fight the antag again would be a pretty clear violation of the "new life" rule

It's not that people you killed will immediately chase you down, it's that you can't really take people out of a round with this change. Unless you kill someone in the last sixth of a round, they will respawn and then can go onto helping the station. It doesn't take long for a person to grab construction tools and begin repairing a hole, or join as doctor and begin healing people. It just makes the action of antags much more reversible because death is now much more impermanent.

You do realize that cloning already exists, yes? If this was going to be an issue, it already would be an issue, cloning gets you back in a minute vs. 10 minutes of sitting out entirely. Unless you're blowing the cloner first thing in the morning, I don't really see why you're so worried about it. 10 minutes is a long time, and does it really matter if they fix the bridge 10 minutes before the shuttle leaves? Think of the people you inconvenience when you rampage and destroy half the station, I think allowing some of them to rebuild after 10 minutes (again, pretending the cloner does not exist) isn't really so bad.

[Ikea]

You do realize that cloning already exists, yes? If this was going to be an issue, it already would be an issue, cloning gets you back in a minute vs. 10 minutes of sitting out entirely. Unless you're blowing the cloner first thing in the morning, I don't really see why you're so worried about it. 10 minutes is a long time, and does it really matter if they fix the bridge 10 minutes before the shuttle leaves? Think of the people you inconvenience when you rampage and destroy half the station, I think allowing some of them to rebuild after 10 minutes (again, pretending the cloner does not exist) isn't really so bad.

A good chunk of people don't get cloned, you can prevent people from being cloned through various means, and also cloning has plenty of discussion regarding its issues. The issue here is less of "rampagers can't station wipe", it's more that antags doing things independently tend to deplete the station of crew. With this change any long term dip in station pop isn't possible as people will just respawn in ten minutes, which will hurt the momentum of antags a lot.

I'd be for a respawn timer on classic, I just think 10 minutes is way too short and Id prefer it to be closer to 15-20 minutes. I get that a respawn timer that long means that you miss a good chunk of the round, but death currently makes you miss all of the round (and also death shouldn't be convenient anyways)

[Snoid]

no thank u. if theres a rampage going on and someones properly wiping out the station, i dont know how youre supposed to pretend u dont know thats going on and not prepare for it immediately. i think there would be no shortage of people abusing it, no matter how many times you ahelp. not to mention all the minor abuses that people generally wouldnt bother ahelping. people would get mad they got killed then come back 10 mins later and start validhunting on the basis of "in my previous life they killed me" whether they admit it or not. i think itd just be more annoying than good. also it gives even less of a reason to be in ling hiveminds.

i could see it being okay if its like, for the first 15 mins of the round then people can be elligible for respawns, but anyone who dies after that isnt.