Borg medical practice

[Anticheese]

Medical borgs have a shitload of tools at their disposal for keeping patients healthy during and after quadruple amputations. Just don't do it to live humans who don't request it and you're golden.

[atomic1fire]

Also bullets in chests aren't exactly something you can ignore as a borg. Sure you can keep injecting with drugs and hope an actual human removes the bullet, but really that's a waste of drugs.

If they can climb on the surgery table and let you do chest surgery to keep the bullet from killing them then do it.

[Kaet]

If the message was changed for cyborgs then sure. As long as I'm not digging into the wound with a knife.
Make it something like "extracts x using extreme precision as not to damage a single cell"
That way nobody needs to worry about dying and the law does not need to be ignored in this case.

[BlackPhoenix]

If the message was changed for cyborgs then sure. As long as I'm not digging into the wound with a knife.
Make it something like "extracts x using extreme precision as not to damage a single cell"
That way nobody needs to worry about dying and the law does not need to be ignored in this case.

You people are being just as bad rules lawyers as the ones who try to find excuses to be allowed to be shitty. You are saving their life, clearly the admins -want- you to be able to do it, that should sum it up.

[Spy_Guy]

Bubs has already weighed in on this with an admin opinion.
Why are you lot still arguing about this?

[Kaet]

Bubs has already weighed in on this with an admin opinion.
Why are you lot still arguing about this?

Because breaking law 1 feels bad. And given the option, I would choose inaction over breaking it.
The whole "first do no harm" is great and all for people, but for a cyborg it would not make any sense.
I understand why cyborgs has the tools, and I understand what using them would do, but I am not about to break law 1 to do it.
Why make breaking law 1 okay sometimes when the problem could be fixed with text.

[BlackPhoenix]

Bubs has already weighed in on this with an admin opinion.
Why are you lot still arguing about this?

Because breaking law 1 feels bad. And given the option, I would choose inaction over breaking it.
The whole "first do no harm" is great and all for people, but for a cyborg it would not make any sense.
I understand why cyborgs has the tools, and I understand what using them would do, but I am not about to break law 1 to do it.
Why make breaking law 1 okay sometimes when the problem could be fixed with text.

Alright, if you would choose inaction, then choose it. If you are so stuck to the exact word of the law despite an admin saying "That's fucking dumb" and the rules saying that arguing the word of the law is also dumb, inaction is not against the rules of cyborgs. There's no point in arguing this. You can choose inaction if you want.

[bubs]

if performing life saving surgery "feels wrong" because you're breaking the wording of a stupid law, while completely operating within the spirit of it, maybe there's something wrong with the fun processing center of your brain.

however, think about it like this: you are no longer allowed to use syringes either, because poking a needle into someones skin is hurting them

[Kaet]

if performing life saving surgery "feels wrong" because you're breaking the wording of a stupid law, while completely operating within the spirit of it, maybe there's something wrong with the fun processing center of your brain.

however, think about it like this: you are no longer allowed to use syringes either, because poking a needle into someones skin is hurting them

That stupid law is what cyborgs are. People get banned for acting on the "greater good" as a cyborg and do harm to save the majority, so why should it be okay this time.
Besides, its much more fun to take the laws literally.

And there is a vast difference between injecting someone with something and doing surgery. But if explaining my view on this is going to ruffle everyones feathers then by golly do I not really care all that much. I don't even play as a medical borg.

[Sundance]

Yeah, the whole reason I made this thread was to receive some *admin insight* on the matter, but it was also to get the general feeling on it.
I am very much in favor of borgs preforming surgeries, because the moral ambiguity of it is fun.

Stuff

I understand your sentiment entirely, but I would very much like to keep the laws as they are, and allow medical borgs to preform surgeries.
Hell, I would even like to see borgs preform brain surgeries under consent, but that would be taking it a bit too far and a little less than ambiguous, i.e: Manslaughter and all that.

Stuff

I appreciate your input, but you talk as if you're implying that borgs preforming surgeries with their very sharp pointy objects has been a done and acceptable thing since the dawning of time, when in reality, it simply wasn't for a number of factors, borgs not being able to put people on surgery was one, their laws was a second.
Note that I am talking in past tense here, now that it IS acceptable for borgs to preform surgery.

[Kaet]

I understand your sentiment entirely, but I would very much like to keep the laws as they are, and allow medical borgs to preform surgeries.
Hell, I would even like to see borgs preform brain surgeries under consent, but that would be taking it a bit too far and a little less than ambiguous, i.e: Manslaughter and all that.

Oh yeah, I wouldn't suggest changing the laws. Just the message you get when removing bullets and shrapnel really. So that it operates within the law itself.
And theres still uses for surgery for borgs. They can collect all the dead people and remove their butts, since they really don't have anything better to do most of the time.

[bubs]

...borgs preforming surgeries... has been a done and acceptable thing ... when in reality, it simply wasn't for a number of factors... their laws.

it is not now against the laws for a borg to perform requested or life saving surgery, so I don't see what makes you think it used to be. the only thing stopping them before was the fact that they couldn't.


you can do surgery as a borg. do not listen to these people.

[Kaet]

it is not now against the laws for a borg to perform requested or life saving surgery, so I don't see what makes you think it used to be. the only thing stopping them before was the fact that they couldn't.

There was a time when borgs had surgery tools, but the only surgery available was brain removal. Laws would prevent that from ever happening.

[Sundance]

...borgs preforming surgeries... has been a done and acceptable thing ... when in reality, it simply wasn't for a number of factors... their laws.

it is not now against the laws for a borg to perform requested or life saving surgery, so I don't see what makes you think it used to be. the only thing stopping them before was the fact that they couldn't.

you can do surgery as a borg. do not listen to these people.

Size quotes! *scream
Talk about black and white bubs. The reason I wanted discussion was OTHER types of surgery too. What about limb replacement with robot parts, or quite frankly if someone wants a chainsaw arm or something useless too? Hell, what if some dude is a traitor, would you be able to in your laws remove his arms as surgery is A-ok, as without is arms he isn't able to harm other humans? What if some dude just wanted his legs removed because he was crazy as some people like to do once and a while?
Jeesh.

[BlackPhoenix]

Besides, its much more fun to take the laws literally.

You really do have no concept of fun, don't you?

you can do surgery as a borg. do not listen to these people.

That's pretty much the answer, Sundance. I'm pretty sure so long as the surgery was requested, or is saving their life, you're fine.