Goonhub
10-01-2022, 12:01 PM
(This post was last modified: 10-01-2022, 12:04 PM by nefarious6th. Edited 1 time in total.)
my take in general is everyone is saying it's a tit for tat of having to overestimate as either sec or a traitor and be unreliant on trusting the good faith of the other players. New antags are going to see the round as ripe for their antics. New sec are going to think they're doing the very model of keeping crew safe when they overextend. Trust that people are learning and growing. It's not an easy process, we have lots of new players coming in all the time, but sec isn't some coinflip "they're probably shit and trying to shut me down", and traitors arent some coinflip "they're probably shit and going to abuse niceties to GAIN antag points and then rampage". Ahelp what has to be ahelped, but culturally, I dont see either side as being More or Less Right about things.
If you're getting batonned in two hits without a word because you broke an APC and didnt put up a chase, That's a problem.
Otherwise, my thoughts from the past few years and watching how things ebb and flow:
- if I'm a geneticist and you're killing my coworker in front of me, I'm going to start a 2v1. If sec is struggling to keep me safe as a botanist or whatever, I can and will step in.
- I think people seeking out being part of an antag plotline is Meh but ultimately not really An Issue to me in that they're risking that they could be killed at any time/thralled/taken out of the round, and that's their risk vs their reward
- people defending violent antags and self antags is soannoying, please just Ask kindly if you have concerns over why someone is being arrested, dont run down the hall screaming at people, and spend the time visiting them if you're so worried. Most maps have visitation centers. Put a phone call in to your friend.
- Even if It Sux, getting your ass batonned by sec, getting arrested, and/or getting your contraband confiscated isnt the end of your run. It's a challenge. Rise to meet it.
- sec reaction to antags is. Reactionary. You wait to see the move from someone and respond. It shouldn't be super surprising to people that if you make a move, sec...responds...
- super Preventative sec play though should be ahelped. Random searches or escalating to search when there's no reason to think someone reasonably has contraband ("hey, you vandalized the kitchen and I'm ticketing you and also now searching you because you will continue to cause problems, I know it!")
And yeah, because sec is reactionary, they dont always take the lead on telegraphing how Fun and Cool and Trustworthy they are. This is hard for newer players espc., but try to have a little faith that the team on the whole has some balance and even if there are a few people who are trying too hard, there'll be another teammate, cap, or hop to help reign them in. If you find yourself in trouble IC, ask for the HoP. Seriously. Consider it an HR matter.
Discounting entire teams of 7-11 players on sec feels super grody though. The chance that every single person on that team behaves as some sort of Maximum Punishment Preventative sort is not high. The belief of such also isnt healthy for the gameplay.
At the end of it all, there's no unanimity to be found on the topic of how and when to antag. It's good to share thoughts but I wouldn't expect anything cohesive out of this because No One Agrees, and at the very least I think that is something we could agree on
If you're getting batonned in two hits without a word because you broke an APC and didnt put up a chase, That's a problem.
Otherwise, my thoughts from the past few years and watching how things ebb and flow:
- if I'm a geneticist and you're killing my coworker in front of me, I'm going to start a 2v1. If sec is struggling to keep me safe as a botanist or whatever, I can and will step in.
- I think people seeking out being part of an antag plotline is Meh but ultimately not really An Issue to me in that they're risking that they could be killed at any time/thralled/taken out of the round, and that's their risk vs their reward
- people defending violent antags and self antags is soannoying, please just Ask kindly if you have concerns over why someone is being arrested, dont run down the hall screaming at people, and spend the time visiting them if you're so worried. Most maps have visitation centers. Put a phone call in to your friend.
- Even if It Sux, getting your ass batonned by sec, getting arrested, and/or getting your contraband confiscated isnt the end of your run. It's a challenge. Rise to meet it.
- sec reaction to antags is. Reactionary. You wait to see the move from someone and respond. It shouldn't be super surprising to people that if you make a move, sec...responds...
- super Preventative sec play though should be ahelped. Random searches or escalating to search when there's no reason to think someone reasonably has contraband ("hey, you vandalized the kitchen and I'm ticketing you and also now searching you because you will continue to cause problems, I know it!")
And yeah, because sec is reactionary, they dont always take the lead on telegraphing how Fun and Cool and Trustworthy they are. This is hard for newer players espc., but try to have a little faith that the team on the whole has some balance and even if there are a few people who are trying too hard, there'll be another teammate, cap, or hop to help reign them in. If you find yourself in trouble IC, ask for the HoP. Seriously. Consider it an HR matter.
Discounting entire teams of 7-11 players on sec feels super grody though. The chance that every single person on that team behaves as some sort of Maximum Punishment Preventative sort is not high. The belief of such also isnt healthy for the gameplay.
At the end of it all, there's no unanimity to be found on the topic of how and when to antag. It's good to share thoughts but I wouldn't expect anything cohesive out of this because No One Agrees, and at the very least I think that is something we could agree on