Goonhub
06-25-2016, 11:52 AM
On Vigilantes:
Once upon a time, the word wasnt even used against somebody who killed a rampager. Everyone just knew that if you went loud, somebody was either gonna kill the traitor in self defense, or a lynch mob would form because the traitor fucked their department and now the displaced crew is without constructive things to do and has a reason to hate the rampager -- these folks often became the "heroes" of the round and exacted due revenge on the traitor. Extra credit, in the form of kudos were handed out to any crew that killed the traitor in a creative or reflective way.
Vigilantes got a bad rap when Vigilante SuperCop Powergamers started to emerge, when any little cry for help had more than enough volunteers rushing to enact some lethal punishment upon the supposed offender. This got a huge backlash once it became problematic, and it actually mostly died out shortly after. It seems established that nobody likes a vigilante that; Breaks into sec, steals or makes sec or traitor level gear, and then goes hunting for anyone they can find an excuse to kill.
Meanwhile, the vigilante who was attacked earlier by the traitor - who saw the traitor with traitor gear actively trying to murder -- He should be well within his rights in hunting the traitor at some later point, be it for revenge, out of annoyance, reason to believe they're still a target, or simply because nobody else seems competent in handling what has become a station-wide threat. Wizards, Nuke-ops, and any visibly supernatural hostiles should be harmed by crew any chance they can get, so long as there isn't any collateral damage. To ignore these threats or hope that some representative from the Sec department is around to save you is counter-intuitive to survival. Hell even some guy boasting on the radio that the last 2 explosions that ruined departments were his doing -- he should probably be knocked over and searched by anyone that doesn't want to explode. Voice changers make it un-cool to kill somebody based on a terrorism claim, but you've certainly got reason to suspect and search. (and fear!)
On a side note,
I need to connect something to the vigilante/crew/traitor relationship that seems to be muddying the waters for admin/player interactions. Check this out -
One round, I join late. I see a dead wizard laying in mechanics. I strip his robe and don his clothes, and suddenly a crewmember breaks into the room and wordlessly empties a phaser clip into me. Enough shots missed that I avoided crit. The wizards pack had a egun inside, which I used to lazer the shit outta my assailant with. I coulda just stunned him but the fact he ran into the room guns blaring and fast-stepping led me to feel that he wasn't entitled to anything so nice. His actions earned him his dues.
Lets review: The wizard was already dead in the same room with me, I lacked a beard, the body had a beard, and the wizard was stated to be dead on the radio.
A non antag crewman breaks in, and despite all this information available to him -- he confidently and violently puts all hes got into rapidly dropping me, all without a word.
Next thing I know I get an admin asking me about this, much to my surprise.
Why surprise when I had just murdered a likely non-antag crewman?
Well... given his behavior I could have assumed him to be an antag. The only thing about this character I've seen is "aggressive attempted murderer" Still, I had a gut feeling that he wasn't.
Well... if the guy bothered to A-help me, then obviously he wasn't expecting me to be an antag, right? Cause if he thought I was a wizard, he'd have taken his death and not a-helped right? So whats he doing?
Well...if the guy I murdered in self defense knew I wasn't an antag -- then why the fuck did he run in guns blazing like you only do when your target is a confirmed antag?
How often do crew wear dead wizards robes? Hmmm... what the fuck was HE thinking then??
Fortunately the admin saw it my way, and I was actually told that I was fine and legit. I was asked to try not to kill if I can, but was right in behaving as I did and was not in trouble.
To connect this to present issues, I think we need to be aware of such A-help "setups" that are essentially a trigger happy player looking for any excuse to kill, then looking for any excuse to A-help. This kind of behavior makes it tough on admins to judge whether a vigilante is being legit or shit. This type of behavior triggers general hate toward all vigilantes, when honestly we need players willing to fight back against confirmed antags that have an established character history of general malice or destruction.
Once upon a time, the word wasnt even used against somebody who killed a rampager. Everyone just knew that if you went loud, somebody was either gonna kill the traitor in self defense, or a lynch mob would form because the traitor fucked their department and now the displaced crew is without constructive things to do and has a reason to hate the rampager -- these folks often became the "heroes" of the round and exacted due revenge on the traitor. Extra credit, in the form of kudos were handed out to any crew that killed the traitor in a creative or reflective way.
Vigilantes got a bad rap when Vigilante SuperCop Powergamers started to emerge, when any little cry for help had more than enough volunteers rushing to enact some lethal punishment upon the supposed offender. This got a huge backlash once it became problematic, and it actually mostly died out shortly after. It seems established that nobody likes a vigilante that; Breaks into sec, steals or makes sec or traitor level gear, and then goes hunting for anyone they can find an excuse to kill.
Meanwhile, the vigilante who was attacked earlier by the traitor - who saw the traitor with traitor gear actively trying to murder -- He should be well within his rights in hunting the traitor at some later point, be it for revenge, out of annoyance, reason to believe they're still a target, or simply because nobody else seems competent in handling what has become a station-wide threat. Wizards, Nuke-ops, and any visibly supernatural hostiles should be harmed by crew any chance they can get, so long as there isn't any collateral damage. To ignore these threats or hope that some representative from the Sec department is around to save you is counter-intuitive to survival. Hell even some guy boasting on the radio that the last 2 explosions that ruined departments were his doing -- he should probably be knocked over and searched by anyone that doesn't want to explode. Voice changers make it un-cool to kill somebody based on a terrorism claim, but you've certainly got reason to suspect and search. (and fear!)
On a side note,
I need to connect something to the vigilante/crew/traitor relationship that seems to be muddying the waters for admin/player interactions. Check this out -
One round, I join late. I see a dead wizard laying in mechanics. I strip his robe and don his clothes, and suddenly a crewmember breaks into the room and wordlessly empties a phaser clip into me. Enough shots missed that I avoided crit. The wizards pack had a egun inside, which I used to lazer the shit outta my assailant with. I coulda just stunned him but the fact he ran into the room guns blaring and fast-stepping led me to feel that he wasn't entitled to anything so nice. His actions earned him his dues.
Lets review: The wizard was already dead in the same room with me, I lacked a beard, the body had a beard, and the wizard was stated to be dead on the radio.
A non antag crewman breaks in, and despite all this information available to him -- he confidently and violently puts all hes got into rapidly dropping me, all without a word.
Next thing I know I get an admin asking me about this, much to my surprise.
Why surprise when I had just murdered a likely non-antag crewman?
Well... given his behavior I could have assumed him to be an antag. The only thing about this character I've seen is "aggressive attempted murderer" Still, I had a gut feeling that he wasn't.
Well... if the guy bothered to A-help me, then obviously he wasn't expecting me to be an antag, right? Cause if he thought I was a wizard, he'd have taken his death and not a-helped right? So whats he doing?
Well...if the guy I murdered in self defense knew I wasn't an antag -- then why the fuck did he run in guns blazing like you only do when your target is a confirmed antag?
How often do crew wear dead wizards robes? Hmmm... what the fuck was HE thinking then??
Fortunately the admin saw it my way, and I was actually told that I was fine and legit. I was asked to try not to kill if I can, but was right in behaving as I did and was not in trouble.
To connect this to present issues, I think we need to be aware of such A-help "setups" that are essentially a trigger happy player looking for any excuse to kill, then looking for any excuse to A-help. This kind of behavior makes it tough on admins to judge whether a vigilante is being legit or shit. This type of behavior triggers general hate toward all vigilantes, when honestly we need players willing to fight back against confirmed antags that have an established character history of general malice or destruction.