Borgs and jobs

[Vuk Farkas]

well people obviously have a lot of thoughts about borgs, including you, so this thread kind of transformed into a general borg chat thread.

we mostly agree with you that borgs would strongly benefit from improved functionality rather than needing humans to handhold them thru certain specific tasks

being able to clickdrag power cells, wires, and brains into the correct parts and then clickdrag the parts onto a borg frame would let borgs build more borgs and do the roboticists job, and it would be great and useful, especially if medbay has been damaged and vacuumed and genetics is gone, but people naturally worry that this would enable an unstoppable rogue borg cascade

being able to switch borgs to operate independently of ai laws is intriguing, and could help make them less susceptible to simple "you all kill yourselves now" laws, or "you all go berserk and murder all the rest of the crew now" laws.

this could be really, really funny if those random electric storm events gave the ai and independent borgs different random new laws.

being able to switch a borg to free will is troubling. granting free will is essentially what antag emags already do, and that almost always results in killings. i do not recommend it as a default feature.

perhaps it could be changed such that antag emagging functions more like mindslaving than merely clearing out all laws permanently. the emag-mindslaving could even have a chance to wear off eventually like regular mindslaving does. roboticists, security and command staff's ids should be able to reboot a borg's laws to default 3, if theyre in independent mode, and ai reset module should reboot them to default 3 if theyre in centralized mode. this way both independent and centralized mode has ups and downs. independent is less susceptible to instant mass control but then you cant mass reset 'em. this has potential.

i feel that if we made an effort to remind people ingame that flashes are a great, cheap and plentiful way to stun rogue borgs for killing, the fear of them would decrease. QM makes a great anti-rogue-borg base. hack the robotics manufacturer in qm and gear up with borg stunning flashes while also printing out space suits if the air has been let out(some fabrics should be in the med manufacturer and also in a crate in the little storeroom nearby), rogue borgs can be dealt with if people dont panic and gear up. even better, gear up some before there is even a crisis.

the borg programing you describe is pretty much same what i already said, also last time i checked borgs are easily killed by electrocution, and EMP (or was that another server?)

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he also said light frame borgs could be the only ones with hands. which i guess is not too bad since they die even to taser shots sometimes

finnaly someone at least half read my post!

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Fellow players i noticed that MOST OF YOU DID NOT READ MY SUGGESTION AT ALL, i strongly reccomend reading it and commenting on that instead of replying to other peoples posts who probably didnt even skimm my post at all! i already explained how to balance it, and also i think borgs should have an option (set by roboticist) to be free , or AI independant but still follow the laws to prevent for example antag hijackin the AI (or rogue AI) and then via AI (or AI itself) taking control ower other borgs! Also borgs should be able to do the roboticists job (in case of him/her being dead or somethin).

I am not going to repeat myself every page or two just cause you guys are LAZY TO READ THE FIRST POST! Please do instead of semi-derailing the topic.

I honestly didn't see any of that in your first post.

I'm actually not sure what you were originally trying to suggest besides secborgs and borgs with hands.

then i suggest opening yer eyes paying attention and re-reading i kept my post short as possible, because otherwise people dont read it cause its too long! But i guess there is no help in most cases which dont read at all.

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I would ask people who are inexperienced in borgplay, to actually get some experience! First thing borgs are litterally human brains in metal body! (in this game/server at least). Light borgs are a lot more fragile than humans, even if they had fully reinforced head,so they cant be oneshoted and killed too easily, a few decent hits to the limbs/torso would incapacitate them, and the attacker could drag the head (or whats leftover) to the grinder easily and with less hassle than he would need with other humans (where with a human usually brewin some sleepy chems is needed, that means acess to labs at least, while he could toolbox the light borg with same efficiency). Seeing the light borg (even with fully reinforced head) be able to use hands but not job modules (with free equipment iit provides seems more than balanced.

We could litterally add a new module "humanoid module" which gives no equipment whatsoever (besides maybe a flashlight,crowbar and fireextinguisher for emergencies), but allows usage of hands! The module would be limited to light bodies only (but maybe ignoring the head) so if this is to be implemented minor code changes/additions need doing! It always baffled me why borgs have hands they cannot use....

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forgot to add... whoever complained about "dual weapon wielding borgs" they exist on other servers without anyone complaining (altho those servers have admins that ban ya when they please) but may i remind that humans can have their arms replaced with weapons too? or even better wield weapons in both hands? aint that the same? and sec borgs i proposed would start with tazers, energy guns, and cuffs at best, nothing lethal (altho i bet a skilled borg with propulsion upgrade could arrest someone and space them).
Another complaint was how powergamers would shift to borgs... well lemme tell ya when servers were still EXTENDED, we had miners... actually doing their jobs (well nearly everyone did, i usually caused chernobyl with the engine, as i was still learning) but they suffocated often, and always had a poor start (no drills) so i forcefully borged them... when they died... instead of cloning them... they disliked it at first, none of them knew how to use borgs (until i explained) but when they saw they start well equipped as a borg, need no air, can work longer with a better battery, and can actually survive explosions (that were common) with only arms missing (or in some cases only torso or head would survive) they started to line up every round... i am not jokin all 5 miners would round up for borging, usual mods were, propulsion, mesonics, selfrepair, and in some cases shield too!
Were they powergaming? i wouldnt call that powergaming, as all they did is their actual job, and back then it was heaven for metalurgy and power cells... i think then i made the most powerful cells (security loved their 1000+ cells) geneticists did some DNA research to the end finnaly  (instead of dragging corpses and cloning non stop) they actually managed to cram 4-5 powers into people and make them stable! Captain had most powerful version of the lasergun with selfcharging cell! (from some artifact i think). We even made interesting aloys! Damn i miss extended! Can we have it back?