Borgs and jobs

[Vitatroll]

Our fellow humans that suffered major body damage and couldnt be cloned, or a violent antag that got borged as an alternative to being spaced, doesnt matter... these machines are too specialized, but well equipped, durable (if reinforced and shielded), and under strict AI laws (unless someone tinkers with their brains).

"well equipped, durable (if reinforced and shielded), and..."

Borgs can self-upgrade last time I checked...-snip-

You gotta remember how strong they are. All access, immune to cold, immune to poison, practically immune to fire, no slips or falls, tougher than humans, can be faster too, practically endless usage of some tools like the RCD, and the list goes on -- not even counting the upgrades like shield or teleport. Borgs are strong. Very. I've seen skilled borg players solo the station with little effort in record times. This is why we have to be careful here.

I'm not an avid borg player, I admit. I need someone to give me an instance where a borg died to human actions that wouldn't have killed a human anyways. I admit I'm not an avid silicon player, but I can say getting tased or shot with lasers or stunned and beat in the head with a fire extinguisher is a guaranteed death for most. You don't even have to worry about being choked as a borg.

They are far better than humans and this is why they are on rails.

This is all nice as is really  however i would like to see at least light bodies being able to use their hands properly  (so basically they become machine people, or fully cybernetic humans). This way we can have Cyborgs that can actually do a job on their own completely (like surgeons doing transplants for example) and they trade off good armor for being able to use their hands! (maybe even their modules that grant them all the equipment).

"so basically they become machine people, or fully cybernetic humans"

That completely undermines the point of borgs. Even if the system changes they should never approach being human, else we might as well ditch borgs all together.

"This way we can have Cyborgs that can actually do a job on their own completely (like surgeons doing transplants for example)"

If we had more people active on the server I'd be against borgs being able to do everything their 'job' entails, as it makes human players inferior, but I'm for it as we are right now. Still, no borgs holding things without a massive change to the system.

"and they trade off good armor for being able to use their hands! (maybe even their modules that grant them all the equipment)."

Take away a light borg's modules and upgrades so they can use their hands? Again, no. It would require changing the entire borg system. Just think about it. It would give rise to double-taser borgs. Euuck. I think it takes 50 damage to crush light cyborg head, but that matters little when they can just go grab some wire and a welder. Again, euuck. Let's not forget the lovable TTV making borg of Great Justice. Yay!

Another thing would be nice if they could be security! To be actually able to catch criminals... integrated tazers and cuffs (but lethal lazers would need to be separatelly added by roboticist, with permission from HoS) with AI and HoS, HoP and Captain holding the kill switch in case somethin goes wrong...

You need to play more rounds on this server if you think any of this is good. Actually, allowing roboticists to give borgs lasers, even with 'permission', is probably the worst idea I've ever seen on this forum. I actually can't think of a worse idea at this moment.

Or other proffessions like science... wery useful there as they need not fret explosions or radiation as much as humans do! And who cares about toxins and freezing temperatures... unless the floor is melting no need to worry... just watch out for that EMP!

I don't think there's anything a borg can't do in science outside of bomb making. In fact, I'm pretty sure a chem borg can do all these things better. Tip: Going to icemoon while unrobust or have a bad connection? Bring an engineering borg and have it solo everything in the tunnels. Honk.

Fellow players i noticed that MOST OF YOU DID NOT READ MY SUGGESTION AT ALL, i strongly reccomend reading it and commenting on that instead of replying to other peoples posts who probably didnt even skimm my post at all!

I did read it, though I admit to ignoring most of it. Mainly anything after the suggestion of secborgs with integrated tasers and possible lasers. Most of us agree that we'd like it if borgs were given more agency, but many of us deemed your ideas as unworkable (on this server) so we tried to expand on them to make the spirit of your idea work.

i already explained how to balance it

Not really. You basically just said you wanted borgs to be more human, and in order to balance this they should be more human. They would basically be superior humans with the downside of No Backpack. The Three Laws? No regular on the station expect a borg to follow every voice command of every asshat staff assistant that thinks it'd be funny to have a borg communicate in nothing but Barks. Borgs under vanilla laws are, in reality, just limited to roughly the same laws non-antag humans are. The only exceptions being no human harm whatsoever. Borgs don't get to be vigilantes? Poor things.

and also i think borgs should have an option (set by roboticist) to be free , or AI independant but still follow the laws to prevent for example antag hijackin the AI (or rogue AI) and then via AI (or AI itself) taking control ower other borgs!

By 'free' I assume you mean 'independent of the AI network' or 'runs on own lawset' and not 'free will', because nobody who's seen free will AI would ever suggest that.

"and also i think borgs should have an option (set by roboticist) to be free , or AI independant but still follow the laws"

Hmm. That's not actually a bad idea. I don't think it'd be a popular idea, but I don't dislike it. Cog2's upload is terribly easy to get into. Making just the AI your pal already gives huge benefits. It would also force more intrigue into killswitching borgs instead of 'Beta-409 hit me with a cardboard tube so I killswitched em before it got bad'. The main problem would be that it shuts down station-wide silicon gimmick laws of which 1 in 50 are actually entertaining.

"to prevent for example antag hijackin the AI (or rogue AI) and then via AI (or AI itself) taking control ower other borgs!"

I have no idea what that was supposed to mean. I assume it's basically the same as the above line, so I'll skip it.

Also borgs should be able to do the roboticists job (in case of him/her being dead or somethin).

On the fence about that. It could be helpful sometimes, but I see it's major use being the propagation of rogue borgs under the current system.

I am not going to repeat myself every page or two just cause you guys are LAZY TO READ THE FIRST POST! Please do instead of semi-derailing the topic.

More or less all of the ideas put forth follow the spirit of your initial concepts. I really hate point-for-point posts like this, but it sounds like that's what you wanted -- so here you go. I agree with you that borgs need be given more agency, I just completely disagree with how you wanted to go about it.