A serious discussion about the state of monkeys

[Glamurio]

Pretty sure I speak for most of the admin team when I say that we aren't interesting in making monkey a consistent character creation option in any form.

Could you elaborate on why that is? I've had some conversations with admins on Discord about this, the overwhelming answer seems to be because "monkeys can be used to grief", which seems an odd statement when it's a bannable offense. Not to mention, why not remove the aspects that allow them to grief, etc.

also monkey gives something for genetics to do, and Lord knows they need interaction and gameplay loop

This seems more of an issue with genetics, and less of an issue with monkeys. But as someone who thoroughly enjoys genetics, I wholly agree, they need a gameplay loop outside of staring at a screen and waiting.

I think you cannot ignore the fact that monkeys are not considered human by AI/Cyborgs(with default laws). While they're not allowed to grief monkeys by server rules, they, for example, don't have to listen to orders given by monkeys, can harm monkeys if ordered to do so by a human (antag) or they could also be collateral damage when following an order made by a human.

While monkeys are not creatable (currently and maybe ever), I've never once seen a Geneticist refuse a simple "Can you turn me into a monkey?" Maybe if people started to abuse this fact and ran to genetics every round start, they would start to refuse it more often though.

True, though there's a weird dissonance regarding how to treat player monkeys, at least on RP. You aren't really allowed to kill a monkey just because they are "non-human", because in some weird sense, player monkeys are technically a mutant race. And you are right that being turned into a monkey isn't an issue in most rounds, though I've certainly seen rounds with no geneticist present, leading to an even more awkward situation where you bunker down in front of their lab in the hopes of someone turning you into a monkey so you can start playing. If this was the same for all mutant races, the lab would be overloaded and you'd see a drastic decrease in usage.