A separate thread to discuss antags (ft. how it relates to metacliquing)

[colossusqw]

my take in general is everyone is saying it's a tit for tat of having to overestimate as either sec or a traitor and be unreliant on trusting the good faith of the other players. New antags are going to see the round as ripe for their antics. New sec are going to think they're doing the very model of keeping crew safe when they overextend. Trust that people are learning and growing. It's not an easy process, we have lots of new players coming in all the time, but sec isn't some coinflip "they're probably shit and trying to shut me down", and traitors arent some coinflip "they're probably shit and going to abuse niceties to GAIN antag points and then rampage". Ahelp what has to be ahelped, but culturally, I dont see either side as being More or Less Right about things.
If you're getting batonned in two hits without a word because you broke an APC and didnt put up a chase, That's a problem.

At least for me, i feel the need to say when i and others pointed out people feel reluctant to trust sec/the crew/antags as of late, we(or at least me personally) aren't talking about defensive action we take on it, rather that the overal climate as of late seems to be causing that on a lot of players. Validhunting is bad, being selective with who you interact is bad, they feed into eachother.
There is a growing lack of trust between antags and security/the crew, and that doesn't seem like something that will go away easily at the moment. Expecially when you join a round and you wanna see something going on, it can be very sad to feel like it's extended because the antag is too scared they'll instantly get shut down to do something cool..