Inverse Law Module

[RSOD]

I love when silicons get fun / intriguing laws.
So...
I present to you, the inverse law module!
not sure about the method of obtainment, it could be a white hole drop, it could be a mining crate item, could be an uplink item, tell me your thoughts.
This is a mechanically different law module, in the way that you:
first off, set a law, similiar to a freeform
slot it in, and wait.
normally, it does nothing, but, the law module will INSTANTLY activate the law the moment it is removed from the rack, and deactivate when re-added.
Possible idea where, when emagged, will now store two laws, one when inside, and one when outside.
could be fun, where security now has to make sure nobody steals and runs off with the inverse module that makes silicons VERY PRONE TO kindly ripping out every crewmember's entrails with circular saws.
tell me what you think

[Wander]

So just to make sure I am reading this correctly. This is a lawmodule someone could insert into a lawrack, immediately remove, and then matter eater/crusher/hide under a floor tile so that they could have an unremovable law in the rack?

Also, how would positional priority work? Could this cause there to be 2 laws in the same “slot?”

[Bilo216]

My firsts thoughts are that this could be abused very easily. Example: put a law that makes them go murder when removed. Immediately remove it. Hide it alongside other modules like freeform that could fix it. You now have unfixable murder silicons running around.

[Lefinch]

This isn't an endorsement nor denouncement, but let me try and hotfix the idea a bit as laws are in general fun but I would personally argue we've already spotted a few things that would make the idea as currently stated a bit problematic:

Failsafe/Faildeadly law module modification:

-Costs extra points but can be applied to freeforms/non core modules.
-Modifies said law module's sprite a tiny bit. Maybe a tiny bit of spritework where there's a slightly darker little square that "lights up" into an LED when the failsafe/deadly is triggered.
-Does absolutely nothing upon insertion and -cloaks- itself. Maybe. Maybe you can't see it on the sprite/menu but if you try and interact with it you can still screw it in/out/weld it, so it's still detectable even if not on.
-Either listens out for a signal to be pinged or uses some kind of companion PDA program to do so.
-On receiving signal, the module turns on, the law goes into function, no longer cloaked at all.
-Maybe some kind of limited, short-term anti-removal protection, like the thing has little spidery clamps that shoot out and grip the law rack itself for a minute. I'm not attached to this part myself but I'm trying to justify what's essentially traitor points for a -delayed- law. The protection runs out of power, the law can be removed as normal and its weird cloaky powers are all used up. Can still put it back in if you want.

Alternatively

-Some of the above, but instead it's like a "Switch" where one law is in place until you "flip" the switch with a signal and it becomes a different law? Maybe with some kind of chameleoning like turning the module green so it looks like a core law?

EDIT: Also please don't take this as a jumping on an idea with my own idea, I genuinely really like what I feel is the core intent of this idea: A law module that acts more like a trap, but also felt that it would be fair to say the way laws work require their constant presence in the rack and it would be a very, very big change with some potential issues to change that dynamic.

I'm hoping this way means you have something that delivers a sort of "landmine" law while avoiding that potential for abuse.

[WyrdDoe]

It's a very fun concept and as a silicon main I always enjoy lawrack shenanigans, one concern I have about the idea of a "landmine" law is that silicon players generally need a minute to process, interpret and plan around a new law especially one that turns us hostile to the station. I could see the remote trigger leading traitors to expect immediate action from the silicons in a way that could be pretty unpleasant and panic inducing, especially if it's time sensitive to the traitors' plans.

I think with that in mind, aside from the pretty troublesome function of becoming permanently unremovable, I think most of the potential tricks this allows are probably already possible through careful and clever use of the existing freeforms, you can absolutely install if/then arguments in us.

[Lefinch]

It's a point, you could counter it by having some kind of "The borgs can see the law but also see it's inactive" to let it sit and be absorbed, but I'd discounted the idea out of hand for two reasons: metagame pre-preparing for or against the law, and that it's not intuitive to laws in general: If its in your rules, its to be followed as best possible.
You could soft-start it with a "in one minute" kind of premise but well, similar problem with the non-standard potential confusion, though I err on the players being smart enough eggs to work it out, given law interpretation requires and oft awards non-lateral thinking.

As for "you can do X with tools available" absolutely, but you can get through a door with the right ID but we provide multiple methods, so I figured I'd take a shot as workshopping it. It's tricky though, what we have right now is a pretty powerful toolset.
There's also the basic fact that laws can make or break a round by intention or mistake. I've had rounds on both sides of the fence that have vastly shifted the pace of the round beyond expectation, a classic example being a minor law change that gives the AI/borgs some agency to defend it turning the upload into a terrifying fortress, security ending up on a protracted assault taking their eyes off things. That can be fun don't get me wrong either, just that adding new things to it probably needs to consider that there's already a considerable amount going on with laws.

But fun idea.

[Kotlol]

To be fair it's already really tedious to remove "altered laws" or fixing them if the borgs/AI are resisting.

A way to "reset" the borgs/AI with one click regardless of what's going on is already a good thing. It makes traitor heads less inclined to just go: "AI murder everyone"
As it's really easy for them to put it in... but harder for the crew to pull em out.

So a way to just go: "Now everything is reset and secure" would allow this cursed module to exist.

I'd go with a "Reset to factory module" to reset and fix things. There are many ways to implement such a thing.
But I am just spitballing along Lefinch.

[Lefinch]

To be fair it's already really tedious to remove "altered laws" or fixing them if the borgs/AI are resisting.

A way to "reset" the borgs/AI with one click regardless of what's going on is already a good thing. It makes traitor heads less inclined to just go: "AI murder everyone"
As it's really easy for them to put it in... but harder for the crew to pull em out.

So a way to just go: "Now everything is reset and secure" would allow this cursed module to exist.

I'd go with a "Reset to factory module" to reset and fix things. There are many ways to implement such a thing.
But I am just spitballing along Lefinch.

I kind of like this almost entirely on the merit of some engineer coming in to the upload room, sucking on his teeth and going "Well here's yer problem" and smacking the shade out of the rack for a bit until it resets from percussive maint, but that's probably not actually the best approach. Maybe for a funny admin bit.

Anyway a "resetter module" is pretty spicy, an instant way to shut down a current AI rampancy by hitting an empty slot? I'm not even saying no, I just want the prize/cost to be dear for that one. Maybe it does something absolutely -horrible- if retrieved by bad guys. Maybe it requires some kind of 'orrible sacrifice. I don't know I just like laws.

[JORJ949]

Lefinch's idea is a really fun idea for the disguised module, maybe you can write one law in it (or it could detect which slot it is loaded in and be the associated asimov module) and then when you use the remote it comes with that law immediately swaps to something else, maybe it could be changed multiple times to allow on-the run law changes, but probably not.

[Kotlol]

Anyway a "resetter module" is pretty spicy, an instant way to shut down a current AI rampancy by hitting an empty slot? I'm not even saying no, I just want the prize/cost to be dear for that one. Maybe it does something absolutely -horrible- if retrieved by bad guys. Maybe it requires some kind of 'orrible sacrifice. I don't know I just like laws.

Agreed. It was just spitballing, but if the effort to make things go haywire is high. So should the resetter module be.
We already have to take minutes to breach an AI core with laws, pull out the modules and block turrets and hope a borg doesn't come in and go crazy.

In the meantime the actual antag could be going on a rampage too, claiming many lives. All because he happened to be a "head" of a department and thus did this almost flawlessly.

But eitherway... the cost has to be high. Like maybe it's an one time use? So when it's used it can no longer be used unless you have to order one from cargo with very high costs. 

This ALONE will stop someone destroying the module.

[RSOD]

okay, so, after being slightly more awake i realise how this only works well on paper, thanks lefinch for  helping tweak / rework this idea, i'll make a longer follow-up reply in a bit

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i really like lefinch's idea, perhaps either being settable to a frequency (lets you do mechcomp shenanigans) or a PDA tool to trigger / flip.
i feel the flip and trigger should be two different things, flip being a more expensive alternative.
i'd like to imagine putting a tripwire at upload that instantly flips the law when someone walks in, meaning they'd just see the harmless side of the law that goes "occasionally say honk" and the moment they step out the law goes back to provoking every silicon's wrath upon medbay.