Suggestions pertaining to Cyborgs/Robotics

[Jillith]

I love cyborgs and I want them to feel as complete as they possibly can be. So here's where I'm presently finding them lacking:

• Round Start: Borgs tend to suffer from a considerable period of downtime at the start of a round due to an immediate need for a roboticist to be present to do most of the work, as well as some time for the fabricators to run. This fact is hardly a dealbreaker, and in the worst case you just have to play a more flimsy and less cute lightborg with only your starting module. I do still feel it's worth exploring ways this can be alleviated, such as by adding a cyborg counterpart to character creation that allows you to select your part preferences when you start a round. And/Or the UI where cyborgs get to set their names at the start of a round could be expanded to include some starting part settings.
  
• Part Swaps: Another minor thing that sort of compounds with the above thing. The actual process of swapping borg parts, especially the head or chest, does nothing to excite me as either the roboticist or the cyborg, and so I think it could stand to be made less cumbersome. For QoL's sake, I'd say if a roboticist is holding a cyborg part and clicking on an activated cyborg with its wires exposed, that should be sufficient for swapping exterior parts while leaving the activated brain and power cell in place. If head swaps are going to remain the first thing a roboticist usually has to do every round, they probably shouldn't also be the most risky. (though I acknowledge they've still got nothing on engineering)
  
• Law Racks: The only thing about these that feels strange is that they appear to be both immovable and indestructible. I'm not entirely sure if that's true, but like an antagonist can blow up the entirety of upload and the borgs will still remain connected to a law rack that's just floating there in space and that's kinda weird! Considering it's possible to build new law racks wholesale, I don't think they warrant being (borderline?) invincible.
  
• Slimy Brains: These are also a bit unintuitive to work with. A slimy brain does not necessarily mean the patient cannot be borged, just that their spirit is currently preoccupied. And so I think you should be able to activate a borg with a slimy brain without it popping out. This would function somewhat like a SICC for the specific player whose brain is inside it: They gain control of the borg as soon as they return to their ghost form (warm brain state). Ideally they might even get a notification while reincarnated (slimy brain state) that their borg shell was activated and is awaiting the warmth of their spirit.
  
• Brobocop Module: From what I glean this module is supposed to be a mashup of secoff and clown, though it is oddly under-equipped for any kind of direct confrontation. I know law 1 is a thing but even the Medical module is capable of disarming people with the defibrilator, so I think giving brobocop some form of stun and maybe one of those riot shields would make it more of an actual security asset. It also does seem funny to me that the module's icon is handcuffs even though it cannot use them.
  
• Civilian Module: A bit odd that the bucket is its only fluid container. I think it could stand to have one or two glass pitchers to help simplify barkeeping tasks.
  
• Science Module: I'd say give them a port-a-sci remote and a bigger fluid container (water cooler jug?) for bulkier Mini-CheMaster processing. I also think it'd be nice if they had efficient ways to check for artifact triggers, like a set of tools that can apply focused heat, shock, radiation and so on at the cost of significant battery drain. And a synthflesh glove or something for testing carbon touch. Lastly, a cargo transporter for managing artifacts would be great.
  
• Medical Module: I think the only thing this module is missing is a genetic analyzer to help confirm when a health problem is the result of flaky genes.
  
• Engineering Module: This module already seems pretty comprehensive but a Floor and Wall Designer would be a fun cherry to top it with.
  
• Mining Module: This one also does everything it really needs to, but I know there are occasionally ores that its mining drill can't ever break down. Probably not worth changing, but maybe a more experienced miner than me would feel differently.
  

That's about everything I've come to notice so far. Thanks for reading and let me know what you think!

[Emimiyu]

Iirc, lawrack is "indestructible" because it used to be so easy to rogue borgs by just coming in to upload then bomb it or decon it. You can still decon it anyway by removing all of the laws and the lawrack can still be destroyed by bombing it twice (ie. Putting two breaching charge on the lawrack, instead of 1). Also, even if it is rebuildable, it requires you to either get the blueprint from the CE office or cargo and on rounds where borgs are lawless, especially on classic game mode, you would expect that most silicon will either be busy murdering you or try in anyway to stop you from fixing the laws.

With brobocop, I think mostly people don't want brobocop to be too effective for security. And giving brobocop stun means giving rogue borgs... stun. Not to mention, there would be a lot of issue where brobocop would either borderline almost breaking law 1 and law 2. Also, with the new security member limit thing, brobocop with stuns seem like making the sec limit on lowpop/medpop less effective.

[Chasu]

The slimy brain and part swap suggestions would be good for QoL, but I think Cyborg modules are good the way they are right now (with the exception of the Civvie module idea; They could really use those pitchers). 
Giving mediborgs gene scanners would make human doctors obsolete, especially when there are 2 or more of them. 
Brobocops shouldn't have stun weapons at all imo (imagine an ultrafast borg chasing after you, being able to stun you and bolt you in effortlessly). 
For artsci, borgs could just use the available machinery, right? I don't think I'm the only person who doesn't like the idea of walking into sci only to see that cyborgs that are better in nearly every way are taking over the positions of scientists.

[Jillith]

Giving mediborgs gene scanners would make human doctors obsolete, especially when there are 2 or more of them. 
Brobocops shouldn't have stun weapons at all imo (imagine an ultrafast borg chasing after you, being able to stun you and bolt you in effortlessly). 
For artsci, borgs could just use the available machinery, right? I don't think I'm the only person who doesn't like the idea of walking into sci only to see that cyborgs that are better in nearly every way are taking over the positions of scientists.

The gene scanner is one of the least-used pieces of medical equipment and only provides a small convenience over leading someone into the genetek scanner or just giving them mutadone. If mediborgs have anything that would make human doctors "obsolete" it's absolutely not the gene analyzer.

It is my opinion that borgs are supposed to be more efficient than humans in each of their roles. That is part of the whole tradeoff where you don't get hands and are bound by laws, as well as part of what makes the law rack worth protecting at all. And in my observation, half of the modules already have things that stand apart in versatility and efficiency from their human counterparts. The science module is simply not one of them.

[meaow589]

the borge already have too much tool already in Medical module if you want to add more tool on it you should remove some tool from it like Surgical tool.but i know more tool mean more fun.i think all of module is fair and balance enough but i like to see more module with interesthing tool that raerly use like ABCU.packet sensor.

[Glamurio]

Among some rather controversial suggestions, there's some genuinely good ideas in your post.

- I doubt you'll see any support for silicon pre-round customization. The admins have a pretty firm stance on not making it any easier for borgs to be self-sufficient, and that certainly includes spawning with all your gear set up. This is, I think, less of an issue with silicons and more of an issue with "roboticists need more things to do".

- Part swaps are definitely antiquated as hell and I could very much see this being a desired change. If someone coded you to be able to just slap a new arm on a borg after you unlocked their compartment and screwed open the wires, I'm sure it'd get added.

- Law Racks shouldn't be indestructible, I agree. It doesn't make sense and feels weird. I'd rather there be some interim period where laws are stored in a cache upon destruction of the law rack so everyone has to hurry to get it fixed while the borgs still have to listen to you. This would make it more engaging and more realistic. Like a count down to fix the laws OR ELSE.

- Slimy Brains being a semi-SICC for one player is also super cool and I'm sure would make it in if someone actually programmed it.

- Brobocops should not receive stun, but they could stand to gain a little more Security focus. Ziptie cuffs and barriers seem great, in a sense that they cannot knock someone down, but they can assist an officer in apprehension. Nothing stronger than a SecAss.

[ju45he]

IMO, give brobocop a bannana projector

Other stations have tried them out, and ultimately they're limited to only the clown module.
They have a limited number of bannanas out at any point, produce a dim light that is enough to distinguish them in the dark, and they cannot be moved but can be destroyed fairly easily.

Brobocops could use them for fun which needs no explanation, and for criminals you could predict where they will run and place bannanas in advance, at the cost of potentially slipping security and not slipping the criminal.

[444explorer]

Law Racks are NOT indesctructible, they just have heavy resistances and generally can only be taken down with explosives reliably.
Roundstart customisation is planned and might be (I have no clue!) in the works. I don't know, I do know basic customsiation for light/standard(?) parts and the screenhead would be the gist of it.
Brobocops are not a mashup of secoff and clown, instead secass and clown. As someone who constantly plays brobocop, they should really not have stun weapons at all, not even bananas or slips - they're not fun on borgs and will just be abused. Maybe ziptie cuffs? That still seems like pushing it though.
Slimy brains are slimy, disconnected players stop cloning, they should stop cyborgification.
Mining module doesn't need better tools, just let borgs put parts on pods if they can't already and use the mining pods.
Also please, don't give Science Module the Portasci. It's head of staff gear so it should be exclusive to the RD. They can already print teleporter modules.
Genetic Scanner would be neat but I don't think it's needed, give people something they need to diagnose by figuring things out instead of having another scanner to tell you it.

These are my opinions on points I feel one way or the other about as someone whos spent the better part of 2 years playing mainly Cyborg and AI.

[Kotlol]

I like to add a few things:

Brobocop is never intended as security. But as a security add on / clown / civilian.
It's a joke module that replaced the security module, since security borgs ran too rampant and made security too strong.

As for every module change:
"NO, cept a few"
Civilian one is what it is, but this is the only one I will allow for bartending habbits.
Porta-sci is a HEAD only tool, ergo cyborgs cannot use it. Remember cyborgs need to ASSIST humans not replace them.
Medical one I see no problem with.
Engineering one is a NO since engineers do cannot spawn with it either and being orderable stops abuse of it.. so we don't want engineer borgs to mess with the looks of the station.


It seems like you want more autonomy for cyborgs but the thing is... cyborgs are purposely made to ASSIST crewmates and is suppose to be a punishment.
Clowns and Monkeyification were original punishments.. but they sorta became their own goofy outcome.
But Cyborgs are waaaaaaay more interactive and can control things remotely. The reason why cyborgs cannot do a lot of things is so crewmates have to work with them.
That's the point of em.

As for customisation and slimy brain stuff. I agree.
Customastion at round start would be nice, if not only to spawn with a screen head. It's just a hassle to replace the head of a cyborg or chest since it kills them :/
And knowing wich brain works would be nice from the get go.

As for anything else.. I have not much to comment on. Part replacement is tedious for a robotcist.. but it's the only thing the robotcist got. I still think robotcists need to have more to do.

[444explorer]

cyborgs are purposely made to ASSIST crewmates and is suppose to be a punishment.

Security might sometimes order borging people but it's not a punishment. It's just a different way to play the game lol.

[Decarcassor]

I also kinda wish we had a true security module instead of the joke brobocop one.

Have it be focused on forensics and protection with a riot shield has its only "weapon". Toss it in the HoS locker too if we feel it could be abused.

[JOELED]

I really really don't think bringing back secborg in any capacity is a good idea honestly. It was removed for a reason, and any step taken back towards that direction (securitron whistles come to mind as a recent example) is immediately taken back for the same reasons

[jan.antilles]

It seems like you want more autonomy for cyborgs but the thing is... cyborgs are purposely made to ASSIST crewmates and is suppose to be a punishment.

Cyborgs are not a "punishment" role, in or out of character. The punishment Sec can give is execution. Borging the person afterwards is an optional favor to keep them in the round, and the person can refuse. This is the same as borging a person who died and was unclonable for any other reason.

Out of character: if I want to ""punish"" someone, it would make no sense to give them a role with AA, no need to breathe/eat, and the ability to become an antag at basically any moment.

Cyborg balance is difficult and still a work in progress from a Dev perspective, but in NO way are they intended to be a "punishment" for the character or player.

[Jillith]

Slimy brains are slimy, disconnected players stop cloning, they should stop cyborgification.

I'm not willing to entertain the idea that one should just leave janky and obtuse mechanics as they are just because another janky and obtuse mechanic is the way it is. We already got some people saying cloning needs to be reworked, but that is another discussion entirely.

Also a slimy brain does not in any way mean the player has disconnected!