about stable mutagen, polymorph gene and some possible changes

[mab]

inspired by a discussion on the discord server. i think a thread is more appropriate so here it is.



referring more to rp servers, because i haven't heard the opinion of classic players.

some people have expressed discomfort about the polymorph gene and and toward people who use it to polymorph into their characters.

some solutions that have been proposed:

• a blood bank in medbay/genetics
  
• change the polymorph gene in some way, such as making the effect last for a short period of time
  
• disable the gene on rp servers
  

SM is also creating the same problems, because it changes the appearance of the characters, sometimes wordlessly/unexpectedly.

i made this thread to gather opinions and suggestions on how to solve this problem. since personally i have no ideas on how the polymorph and SM can be changed, but i see that many people are uncomfortable with them and i hope we can find a solution.

[Gustav_Goldman]

Some people (myself included) think using mutadone to force people back to their original form would be the best fix for this problem!

[Meowgical]

I think the unfortunate thing is that you will not be able to please everyone with changes to SM or Poly. I want to keep in mind that these traits and genes are important and can lead to interesting RP, Antagonist moves and escape, etc.;
So personally? I wouldn’t really change the gene itself or trait. I think the good it would do for a select few players isn’t enough to balance out what it does to the greater game. But!
I think a solution would be simply giving a little responsibility to genetics or medical. I personally love the idea of the cloner recording and being able to store blood upon a scan. It should produce very little blood, have a short cooldown, and it works as a :
1) benefit to being scanned even if you never die
2) entice people to scan
3) store blood for transformation be it back into your original form or! Into a new one if you are planning something antaggy.
With polymorph itself? Mutadone would be fine but Id rather it not be an option.

[CalliopeSoups]

Poly is mostly just annoying, being able to mutadone them to revert their identity if needed would be great, though that sounds like a nightmare to code.

SM is a bit more commonly loathed and would be solved entirely by adding a way to get your identity back. I'm all onboard with the blood bank concept, just something optional at medbay you can get done if you're concerned about your identity being changed. I'm aware you could technically just do this by giving the MDir a syringe of your blood, but a dedicated terminal or functionality in the cloner or genetics lab would provide an actual mechanic for it, and maybe encourage SM usage more as people turning back after some time could create its own confusion.

[Kotlol]

Trickster Wraith can become a perfect copy of you and cause confusion. (Though when I saw it, it had a glitch revealing it's idenity by simply checking something. Luckily it's been noted and fixed)

The thing is... Trickster Puppets are TEMPORARELY and are ment to sow chaos and confusion. It's a funny wraith that talks and thus doing this... makes it fun.

BUT... The polymorph gene is used alot to just "Change forms" and it's annoying in RP when someone walks up to me, touches me, becomes me , says "I AM YOU" and runs off.
In that time alone I felt no setup for the change, the setup for the change is just funny, and running off before I react.

Polymorph has some AMAZING RP potential. If anything the mind set around Polymorph needs to be changed from "Funny gene to look like others" to "RP situations."

[Waffleloffle]

I'd love a nerf of some sort to polymorph that makes it shittier unless specifically empowered or synchronized or something like that, it does kind of feel unfair that geneticists can get a gene that straight up outclasses a ling's impersonation ability

with stable mutagen, there's definitely more of an opportunity cost to using it and you need a pretty significant amount to fully transform, so I think it's pretty balanced in a vacuum. the blood bank is still a great idea and I can probably provide sprites for it if anyone would be able to code it

[Silent Majority]

I'd like it if it just gave a clear defentive marker that it wasn't their name, was temporary, or could be reversed. I actualyl pujt a thread about this, tis a simple mutation that causes an instant change to someone's appearance permanently allowing them to steal someones identity, it happens instantly and cannot be resisted. its better then a ling in every way

[Bartimeus]

Non-empowered polymorphism could give you small errors that may allow the more attentive people to discern who's the shapeshifter. Like a one or two letter "mistake" in the name, or a hair color that is slightly off. Alternatively, it could require an action bar and both people to stand still for awhile while you transform your body into theirs.
The one thing i'd really like to see changed is the DNA modification. Leave the fact that lings copy your dna to only changelings, and make the polymorphism gene only steal the name, appearance and fingerprints, but not the dna. That way, someone with a forensic scanner can quickly deduce that something is wrong with a quick check.

[Lord_earthfire]

I'm against changing it in it's basic function.

Identity theft makes for great plots. And i think the "find out who is the real person" should not be solved too easily. But the effect shouldn't be too easy to aquire, either.

That's why i like the "cure" of mutadone for normal polymorph and stable mutagen. I think empowered polymorph shouldn't be cured by mutadone. If someone goes the extra mile for empowered polymorph, they should have proper doubleganger RP.

I took stable mutagen as well into the "cure" category as well, because once you have blood of the person you targeted, you can polymorph bsck into it.

The only real problem i have is that all this would essentially nerf the ling sting and remove "shitty bill"-plagues (and i kinda like them...) Maybe make the ling sting work like empowered polymorph?

[Kotlol]

I'm against changing it in it's basic function.

Identity theft makes for great plots. And i think the "find out who is the real person" should not be solved too easily. But the effect shouldn't be too easy to aquire, either.

That's why i like the "cure" of mutadone for normal polymorph and stable mutagen. I think empowered polymorph shouldn't be cured by mutadone. If someone goes the extra mile for empowered polymorph, they should have proper doubleganger RP.

I took stable mutagen as well into the "cure" category as well, because once you have blood of the person you targeted, you can polymorph bsck into it.

The only real problem i have is that all this would essentially nerf the ling sting and remove  "shitty bill"-plagues (and i kinda like them...) Maybe make the ling sting work like empowered polymorph?

To cure shitty bill plagues you need to subjects original blood. Done.
To change someone back from empowered polymorph, you need their original blood. Done.

This means it's on the player if they want to change back by giving blood to clone bay or for safe keeping.
For polymorphers who go the extra mile, now must risk not being scanned (wich aint the worst) to stay that way.

Also empowered is a perfect copy, while standard may have flaws like missspellings in names and such.

[ThatScarlett]

Meowgical's idea of having a small blood sample upon clone-scanning seems pretty nice... Usually not many people clone-scan, feels like an alright solution to have been transformed into someone else by stable mutagen.

[Lord_earthfire]

Oh, i didn't saw that suggestion, yeah, that would be perfect.

[FishyCrea]

This discussion came up again recently so I just wanna try and maybe revive some interest, but I really do think *some* way to restore someone's original appearance is desperately needed. People generally tend to use SM to change *other* people's appearances, and that's something that a *lot* of players just really aren't comfortable with. The blood bank idea is probably the best solution that's not just removing SM altogether (which, let's be honest, there are a billion other options for traitors to do the same thing that isn't SM.)

[Silent Majority]

I believe sm should be flat removed. Or maybe only work as a pill. There's items, antag powers, and mutant abilities. Do we need it with chems. Too? Chems thst take 5 seconds to make

[babayetu83]

well i mean you might as well rework changeling too if people are uncomfortable with people being their character/being turned into a different character