[ANTAGONIST] Make Krampus 3 Unpoppable!

[YoukCat]

Krampus is supposed to be an Antagonist. I never saw the first one, but wasn't it supposed to kill people? Removing Krampus Meatcube's unpoppable nature makes Krampus too weak to safely do many gimmicks. I vote we make Krampus unpoppable again.


EDIT:

I can try and give reasons in a more logical and orderly fashion instead of a "I WANT KRAMPUS BACK" fashion.

1. We need a penalty for reaching 0 Christmas Cheer.
If there is a good benefit for reaching 100 Christmas Cheer, there should be a bad thing that happens when you reach 0 Christmas Cheer. Along with that, it gives more reason to fight back against the Grinch antagonist, and gives a reward for reaching 0 Christmas Cheer. The rest of my reasons will be why Krampus should be the 0 Christmas Cheer Penalty.

2. Krampus is more fun to play as than the other options, but is also weak enough/reproducable enough (just become a meatcube yourself) that you can trust players not to kill things and then commit suicide for it.
People that do kill things and commit suicide for it are clearly not the brightest, considering they can just do a bit of chem work to become a meatcube. Along with that, being Krampus is another entertaining thing for the Dead to be, considering the Dead are outted from the game until next round anyway.

3. Krampus is more fun for others, since it's gimmicky and doesn't have ways to seriously end your game.
Krampus is entertaining for others as well. I've never been saddened by a Krampus Meatcube. Others have been saddened by them, however that is likely because Krampus is supposed to be a punishment to people for letting Christmas Cheer get to 0. It's a fairly kind punishment, since it doesn't result in that much death and instead results in a farty, immortal meatcube.

4. Krampus is still a punishment for letting Christmas Cheer get to 0, and can easily be destroyed once Christmas Cheer gets back to 100.
Santa literally has a button that kills Krampus if I'm correct. If you let Christmas Cheer get to 0, you shouldn't be given a pat on the back, you should have to deal with a little bit of sadness.

5. Krampus is Tradition.
Krampus is one of the most memorable (and cutest) things in SS13 Spacemas. It's supposed to be the Manifestation of Grief, not an easily poppable, forgettable creature.  As Frank puts, it's a symbol for the bizarre humor and grief that people inflict on each other condensed into a small fleshy hate cube. Removing Krampus would take much of the soul of Goonstation Spacemas.

[Xeram]

You know how wraith is shit and an exercise in frustration to be in the presence of because its nearly immortal?

How about we have that every fucking round. (No.)

[ChrisOniell69]

I very much enjoyed unkillable Krampus, and as something that only happens a couple weeks out of the year I don't think it was overdone. The annoyingness of it going around blocking people was just minorly annoying for one person at a time and I think it was very much in line with being a Spacemas shitter!

[Frank_Stein]

I very much enjoyed unkillable Krampus, and as something that only happens a couple weeks out of the year I don't think it was overdone. The annoyingness of it going around blocking people was just minorly annoying for one person at a time and I think it was very much in line with being a Spacemas shitter!

Agreed. It's a few weeks of annoyance that's part of the holiday spirit

[Superlagg]

Maybe popping him shouldn't kill him, just make him able to me moved around. Cus you can't kill the antichristmas spirit.

[Lady Birb]

How about giving Krampus the ability to instantly respawn at arrivals if popped? Popping only removes them from the immediate area, there is no way to truely be rid of krampus.

[mbc]

my opinion follows, not trying to rep the whole admin team here:

i hate it. unkillable krampus, in the worst case, has the potential to be extremely shit and griff the hell out of other players, in some cases even more efficiently than an actual traitor could have done it. Here are some actual examples that I have seen:

- Krampus stands in front of the cloning machine. When someone attempts to bring a body in and set up the cloning process, Krampus pushes or pulls them onto an exposed grille with a live wire running through it. Then Krampus proceeds to drag them back and forth over the exposed grille, shocking them repeatedly until they die.
- Krampus boards a well-equipped spacepod. Krampus proceeds to gun down everyone on the escape shuttle, and optionally may Pull the wounded crewmembers out into space.
- Krampus stands in front of a tight entryway to an important area and pushes anyone who tries to enter out of the way.

this would be funny if it was once in a blue moon, but Krampus appears Very often, almost every other round. The main problem here is that players have no way to protect themselves from Krampus at all. If he was at least stunnable, maybe my opinion would change! But being untouchable is simply too powerful as it was in K2.0.

[Frank_Stein]

There's a full proof way to get rid of the Krampus and that's to have a love of Spacemas and cheer in your heart

[babayetu83]

just have krampus' strength be tied to christmas cheer and what they can and cant do be based off that

[69andahalf]

Krampus was invincible this year, people were shitters with it (surprise surprise) so it got nerfed. Not that many people even know how to pop meatcubes, so that's a plus at least.

[NateTheSquid]

did not read literally any of the posts here, fuck your arguments. krampus as a poppable meatcube is fucking useless! theres literally no point in having it! if i wanted to be a regular-ass meatcube i'd just make some LDM (which is crazy easy to do) and meatcube myself. krampus is an antag! he's supposed to fuck with people/kill if possible! why would you get mad that people use the role to do it's damn job!

i'm actually really mad about this change, which is rare. now that i've read some of the replies to this, mainly mbc's reasoning: krampus can stand in front of the cloner and be an ass, but surely we could have some kind of 'super strong christmas spirit' bullshit that prevents him from going near the cloning room? and wasnt the ability for meatcubes to pilot pods literally removed like a week ago or something??

and last of all, santa has the 'banish krampus' ability, but the two of them never spawn in the same goddamn round given how rare santa is. we could either make krampus stunnable (and probably draggable while stunned) via normal means or lit welders stun him? who knows. OR just make santa more common. his abilities barely have any impact on rounds besides the ability to banish krampus, which would also help this problem!!!!

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How about giving Krampus the ability to instantly respawn at arrivals if popped? Popping only removes them from the immediate area, there is no way to truely be rid of krampus.

also this is a good idea

[YoukCat]

Natesquid summarizes all of my arguments.

[Vitatroll]

It's a holiday antag that can do 3 things: drag, click-drag, and not die. Antag being the key word. It definitely felt knee-jerky and honestly a bit spoon-feedy.

If people suck so bad then we need a new gimmick by next year. Crippled-krampus just doesn't cut it for spacemas jeer. It's like Christopher Reeves playing Superman after falling off the horse.

[Haprenti]

Removing the ability to push people (While keeping the push immunity unless maybe while stunned as stated) also gets rid of two of the problems cited as an example. Not being able to enter pods as Krampus is an obvious solution for the other example.

[Sundance]

Haven't been playing much, but making krampus poppable (which i'm assuming is killing it?) is terrible and comes across as really tone-deaf.

He's an antagonist. It's whole "being an immovable object" is literally his only power.

If you're trapped in a room because krampus is blocking the way well guess what? That's a player behind that sack of squirming shit, they are literally doing the one purpose Krampus was meant to be: An annoying sack of squirming shit. If you're annoyed about that, I question your ability to deal with scenarios within the game because I can think of 1001 more annoying things players can do even as non-antagonist.

Although I will say that the design of Krampus seems to purely being an annoying fuck, I do question it's ability to murder. It should be ambivalent to life around it, it shouldn't be actively murdering. Blocking a door to the med supplies yes. Blocking the door to the escape shuttle, yes. But also blocking antaognists to get their sweet final deathblow.

The examples that MBC gave seem to point that there's an issue with krampus when it comes to murder. Pushing/pulling and boarding pods seems to be a key issue here. The tight hallway again I reiterate is literally his purpose. Also if I recall last time I noticed people could use the Stand/duck under flap trick to bypass Krampus. This is also stupid. To add, cornering players and stripping them is never not hilarious.

EDIT: Admittedly this seems to be quite divisive. I'd say put it to a vote.