Let us cram metal sheets, glass, and wires into manufacturers again

[Berrik]

Seriously, refilling them right now is kinda annoying if there's no miners around, especially since ejecting crap from other manufacturers to fill the one you want causes you to get a huge giant stack of individual bars.

[Technature]

ejecting crap from other manufacturers to fill the one you want causes you to get a huge giant stack of individual bars.

Drag items to a floor tile to sort all of that type of item into one stack.  Makes shit much easier to work with.

Rest of the post is pretty reasonable too.

[babayetu83]

that doesnt work for me, i have to manually and painstakingly drag them into a stack one at a time

[Technature]

Really?  Sounds like something to put in the bugs, I'll try to keep an eye for a chance to test it out myself.

[NateTheSquid]

wonder if berrik has ever used the mentorhelp command. or you know, asked about a thing before making a thread about it

[poland spring]

Not being able to melt down steel sheets is incredibly dumb

[Cyfarfod]

I agree with this, but from my end is because it's so frustrating to start mining (you know, the phase where all you care about is some bohrum and some claretine) and get one of the... ship wreckage, or whatever, "asteroids" with plenty of bohrum metal sheets.

If I wanted to build a bohrum house, that is, cuz they aren't helpful for industrial space suits, that's for sure!

It sees like sheets and rods and such would be pretty effective as feedstock for a fabricator, IMO.

[Sundance]

Sheets and rods used to be able to feed into the fabricator, I absolutely remember this as much.

Why it changed? Beats me. But not being able to recycle stuff is incredibly lame.

[Tarmunora]

It was changed because Keelin didn't like duplication bugs. They still exist, but are more annoying to do these days

[Dr Zoidcrab]

If duplication bugs are the problem a solution would be to make 1 bar = 1 material = 1 sheet = 1 rod = 1 tile etc, increase the amount of starting bars in fabricators, adjust the cost of things that require rare materials like uqill, then sheets/rods/tiles/components could be used in the reclaimer/processor again without having to worry about fixing duplication bugs every time a change is made.

[Sundance]

Material code is a nightmare because of all this tooing and froing between what seems to work and what definitely doesn't. While on paper 1:1 seems like a good solution it WILL create duplicates. Here's an example:

Process 1 tile = 1 bar. Process 1 bar = 1 sheet. Process 1 sheet for (I believe it’s 4?) tiles. Use one of those tiles to start again. Suddenly you have 26 bars from processing a single tile. Not good.

OR it could create the opposite effect, example:

Process 1 tile = 1 bar. Process 1 bar = 1 sheet. Process 1 sheet for 1 tile. Infer that 1 bar = 1 metal tile. That's utterly wasteful and would require like 36 metal bars for 36 metal tiles.


Honestly I'm just tired of the material system. The X naming system of creating unique alloys is, at best, gimmicky and far too open ended. Creating alloys, which takes averages of all the material, instead of adding intrinsic bonuses ACTIVELY DISCOURAGES users to create unique alloys and instead forces people to stick to making elemental. Why bother spending time making an Uqill Bohrum Cerenkite Alloy when Uqill alone is superior?
Hell why bother doing anything AT ALL when you can rob armor from security which will take all of 5 minutes, while making Uqill/Nanocarbon alloy will take 10 minutes, you'll be hacked to shit in the process and the armor that you make is not only ugly, it's worse than the one in security. This annoyance applies to almost everything in material system. You know there’s a huge problem when plasma shard as an item is stronger than anything you can make out of the forge. A fucking plasma shard.
It also doesn’t help that the stuff you can make is woefully BORING. The bow and arrow was legit the only interesting thing and afaik that’s broken now?

Sorry had to get it out of my system. But seriously now. It’s really time to scrap this system. It's been like this for what, 2 years? 3 years? How many times has it been revised? 4 times?

If we revert back, we could instead use a close ended system where combined elements would make specific unique alloys instead of this averaging system. That would simplify everything code-wise and would allow people to submit patches to have new tools/weapons without wanting to spoon out their eyes in the process. The fun experimentation end of things would be in constructing the tools with robust stats to make things like unique spears, such as having a heavy uqill spear that’s blunt but causes significant stamina damage when thrown but doesn’t go very far, or a crystal spear that causes high laceration damage but next to no stamina damage but can be thrown very far.
Doesn’t that sound so much more fulfilling?? Am I wrong here?

Eh. A man can surely dream.

[atamusvaleo]

[Dr Zoidcrab]

Material code is a nightmare because of all this tooing and froing between what seems to work and what definitely doesn't. While on paper 1:1 seems like a good solution it WILL create duplicates. Here's an example:

Process 1 tile = 1 bar. Process 1 bar = 1 sheet. Process 1 sheet for (I believe it’s 4?) tiles. Use one of those tiles to start again. Suddenly you have 26 bars from processing a single tile. Not good.

OR it could create the opposite effect, example:

Process 1 tile = 1 bar. Process 1 bar = 1 sheet. Process 1 sheet for 1 tile. Infer that 1 bar = 1 metal tile. That's utterly wasteful and would require like 36 metal bars for 36 metal tiles.

Your second example (which is what I meant when I said 1:1) would only be wasteful if there were no changes whatsoever to default material availability, and even now mining almost always ends up with a massive excess of basic materials, and cargo can buy glass and steel for ten credits per sheet. It also means you don't have to pry up 40 floor tiles or break 20 grilles to get 1 bar of material, or 40/20 bars because of dupe bugs.

I also think the ability to make 10 reinforced windows out of a single block of uqill or plasmaglass is a bit much.

[Sundance]

Material code is a nightmare because of all this tooing and froing between what seems to work and what definitely doesn't. While on paper 1:1 seems like a good solution it WILL create duplicates. Here's an example:

Process 1 tile = 1 bar. Process 1 bar = 1 sheet. Process 1 sheet for (I believe it’s 4?) tiles. Use one of those tiles to start again. Suddenly you have 26 bars from processing a single tile. Not good.

OR it could create the opposite effect, example:

Process 1 tile = 1 bar. Process 1 bar = 1 sheet. Process 1 sheet for 1 tile. Infer that 1 bar = 1 metal tile. That's utterly wasteful and would require like 36 metal bars for 36 metal tiles.

Your second example (which is what I meant when I said 1:1) would only be wasteful if there were no changes whatsoever to default material availability, and even now mining almost always ends up with a massive excess of basic materials, and cargo can buy glass and steel for ten credits per sheet. It also means you don't have to pry up 40 floor tiles or break 20 grilles to get 1 bar of material, or 40/20 bars because of dupe bugs.

I also think the ability to make 10 reinforced windows out of a single block of uqill or plasmaglass is a bit much.

I agree with you on the uqill/plasma glass. The bare bones of my point is that this would make average repair (such as plain steel floor / windows) a pain in the ass to do. How would you get it where 1:1 ratio would work so it's not a fucking pain in the ass for plain work?

1.Double the current stackable amount of metal/glass. If it's 1:1 it's going to gobble a fuckton of resource if you're just making floortiles, etc. This would also include any material ordered from QM. Cable, as an conductor doesn't really need to be touched and already is bundled up in rather large amounts.
2. Increase the amount mined from the 3 base materials: metal, glass and copper.

This means 1:1 ratio with the above tweak would mean that firstly shit can be recycled, secondly high quality material will be resource hungry, and thirdly construction material will also be resource hungry but plentiful.

[Frank_Stein]

I think it might have been you, Sundance, who once suggested that mining ore quality have a hand in how many bars/blocks it produces.

Something like

Low quality ore: 10 bars
Mid quality ore:  30 bars
High quality ore: 50 bars