Goonhub
09-17-2023, 06:01 AM
Goes for goon1 really, I'll setup a few examples below:
Mixed (action):
num_enemies = clamp(round((num_players + i) / num_enemies_divisor), 1, traitors_possible)
This currently translates to taking the current player count, adding a random number from 0 to 25 (?!), dividing that by 10, and clamping it between 1 and 8.
Let's say we have 15 players online for mixed action, and i = 25. That's (15+25)/10 for 4 antags. Pretty bad for the crew, since that means almost 1/3 the station rolled antagonist. (This is more pronounced for lower pops, but medium pops of 30-40 get the upwards of 2-3 extra antags too.)
(Worth noting that num_enemies is NOT 1:1 with antag count since major threats count as several, but the point stands I feel.)
Changeling:
Max of 4 changelings, period.
Same equation is used, but i is at max 5 and the divisor is 15.
For 30pop, this means a consistent 2 changelings. Seems fair..? Yet at the same time, it can lead to boring shifts when neither do much, but that's just SS13.
Blob:
Min 2, max 4 blobs. I've never seen 4 outside of super high pop though.
Same equation, but 'i' is from -5 to 0? Why? ok..
Well, take 30pop with 0, It's /18 to be rounded to 2.
To get consistently 4 blobs, you'd need 77 players.
Nukies is one gamemode I've noticed doesn't use randomness in its antag calculation, instead being a clamped, rounded population/6. I think it's a bit silly to say 6 crew per operative is fair, though, considering the amount of bullets each one gets.
This gets the big text, my main point of making this thread is to bring attention to the odd balancing of antags. It leads to many shifts where the sheer quantity of antags (+midrolls) decimate the station, and others where there is a small, small amount of antagonists. I'm a bit surprised to find there's a random factor, too.
This comes from seeing a lot of discussion on the discord over time, I think it deserves a thread here. It would be nice to make clear the point of all these hoops for scaling and maybe understand whether or not this is intentional, because it seems a good handful of people point it out like it's not now and again. As for the suggestion? I suggest the numbers get formally shuffled around again to try and prevent both snoozefest shifts and murderbone shifts from being so present.
Mixed (action):
num_enemies = clamp(round((num_players + i) / num_enemies_divisor), 1, traitors_possible)
This currently translates to taking the current player count, adding a random number from 0 to 25 (?!), dividing that by 10, and clamping it between 1 and 8.
Let's say we have 15 players online for mixed action, and i = 25. That's (15+25)/10 for 4 antags. Pretty bad for the crew, since that means almost 1/3 the station rolled antagonist. (This is more pronounced for lower pops, but medium pops of 30-40 get the upwards of 2-3 extra antags too.)
(Worth noting that num_enemies is NOT 1:1 with antag count since major threats count as several, but the point stands I feel.)
Changeling:
Max of 4 changelings, period.
Same equation is used, but i is at max 5 and the divisor is 15.
For 30pop, this means a consistent 2 changelings. Seems fair..? Yet at the same time, it can lead to boring shifts when neither do much, but that's just SS13.
Blob:
Min 2, max 4 blobs. I've never seen 4 outside of super high pop though.
Same equation, but 'i' is from -5 to 0? Why? ok..
Well, take 30pop with 0, It's /18 to be rounded to 2.
To get consistently 4 blobs, you'd need 77 players.
Nukies is one gamemode I've noticed doesn't use randomness in its antag calculation, instead being a clamped, rounded population/6. I think it's a bit silly to say 6 crew per operative is fair, though, considering the amount of bullets each one gets.
This gets the big text, my main point of making this thread is to bring attention to the odd balancing of antags. It leads to many shifts where the sheer quantity of antags (+midrolls) decimate the station, and others where there is a small, small amount of antagonists. I'm a bit surprised to find there's a random factor, too.
This comes from seeing a lot of discussion on the discord over time, I think it deserves a thread here. It would be nice to make clear the point of all these hoops for scaling and maybe understand whether or not this is intentional, because it seems a good handful of people point it out like it's not now and again. As for the suggestion? I suggest the numbers get formally shuffled around again to try and prevent both snoozefest shifts and murderbone shifts from being so present.
