Let suicides set off suicide vests

[TheOnlyRyan]

Pretty straight forward, I had an idea of finding a instantly killing suicide method (I used cuffs) combined with a suicide vest with pipe bomb to kill a wizard.

However I learned that suicides do not set off the suicide vest which REALLY perplexes me. 

I can understand (A little) why suicides dont set off Macro/Microbombs, they're far more deadly, especially macros. People could just get salty about being arrested then suicide. So yeah, macrobombs / microbombs should remain how they are currently.

But suicide jackets, THEY'RE CALLED SUICIDE JACKETS... I mean come on, I was REALLY disappointed when I pulled my brain out with the cuffs and the jacket didnt go off, the jackets a physical item, completely viewable by people so they for one, know you're wearing it, they know to remove it ASAP (unlike macrobombs) and they're far, far less deadly. Unless of course a very very good chemist uses it in which case good for them for being a good chemist.

I feel this would be an easy thing to change and also wouldnt change the meta too much, and will actually result in far more funny scenarios, perhaps hostage situations, giving one to a mindslave. Things like this.

Out of the many suggestions ive made I'm 10x more eager for this one to be implemented, even for a beta test to make sure people arent too shit with it. (Although bare in mind anything new people will spam for a day or two)

In my opinion (SUICIDE) vests should work with suicides, please make it happen!

[Nnystyxx]

Yeah, I don't see why they don't, they ARE SUICIDE vests
Exactly what you said about macro/microbombs, but like, suicide vests are far more balanced in deployment in comparison, you can't just shoot a macrobomb into your brain with those
What else are you going to do, toolbox yourself with the vest and wait for crit?? Get shot and wait to suffocate? I mean, maybe, but that kind of defeats the point!!

[TheOnlyRyan]

Have also found out artifact beakers cannot be put in the suicide vests like normal beakers can, yet you can put a watering can in a chem dispenser and your backpack?

Please add this in too.

[TheOnlyRyan]

81 views and 1 response, I'm not looking for essays guys but if you're in favor or against ? A simple yes or no.

[misto]

it sounds fair enough to me. you probably are not getting much input because a lot of people seem to disapprove of suicide bombing for one reason or another.

or, you know

maybe it could have an explode button the wearer can just press?

[TheOnlyRyan]

If people disapprove of suicide bombing they should tell post it in the thread :P.

I for one find suicide bombing hilarious, theres nothing quite like going out on a bang, even if suicide vest bangs are small.

[Vitatroll]

It's one of those things I'm not too clear on -- largely because of admins being individuals with opinions. I've seen people get yelled at for it. I've also seen it almost praised. Mostly yelled at though. That just goes for suicide bombing.

In a recent 'Is it okay to bomb antagonists?' thread there was this:

It is OK to:
- Mine with bombs
- Refine your bombs in the testing area
- Destroy large chunks of blob. This must be done in areas which are beyond recovery, such as already vented edges of station.  If it harms anyone else or vents an area with any kind of traffic, we will crack the shit down on you.

It is not OK to:
- Bomb antagonists. If it harms anyone else or vents an area with any kind of traffic, we will crack the shit down on you.

For the record, we don't care that you patched it up afterwards. It's still been sucking air out for over 2 minutes, it's likely to stay too cold and too thin in air for traversal.

This is a very thin line, I do realize. But you have to be absolutely sure you're not fucking anything or anyone up if you're going to go for bombing an antagonist, we understand that someone minmaxes it out far too bad occasionally - decide whether or not the consequences of messing up are worth it to you.

Now for me? I find it perfectly a-ok to pipebomb a genetically enhanced (SMES, Heatres, Xray, etc) superling that's armed to the tendrils with eguns. Otherwise it's just "Hey, let's all just give up and die." At least until he grabs an indysuit. RIP. That's when you have to rely on chemnerds, which is a kind-of fight OP with OP scenario.

Disconnected from all that: the idea itself? Yeah, I think it's perfectly reasonable for a suicide vest to work for suicides. Not much different than finding a russian revolver or eating a half-dozen lasers.

[Nnystyxx]

if we have to choose between "damage small amount of station" and "die to unstoppable nerd who probably damages large amounts of the station" I WILL CHOOSE THE FORMER
even i hate breaches but jesus people gotta protect themselves

(ALSO: making it such a heavy punishment based on the factor the atmos is horrible and frustrating should be an impetus to figure out what to do about the fucking atmos/cold slowdown/air being hard to refill)

[Vitatroll]

People are assholes. If they hear it's flat-out okay to bomb antags then they'll bomb any antag. There was a point in time where it became popular to bomb/suicide bomb clowncars. Right now it's a 'use at your own risk', and I find that okay. I know a several people who would gladly kill a dozen other players with bombs every round if they could justify it with fair use.

You lot do too.

So yeah, use at own risk. I haven't been yelled at so far, but I'm very particular so *shrug.

[Sundance]

The topic isn't about bombing, its about suicide bombing, and the suicide vest. The difference is not subtle so stop derailing it.
It's a matter of balance, enough of the contrived logic. "people gotta protect themselves" .. oh please. 
Think about this from an antagonist perspective. If you're an antagonist and some of the crew are literally explosive, then you're not going to be an antagonist for very long. There is very little counters you can do as an antagonist if people are going to be exploding any time you capture them and they suicide. 

Pretty straight forward, I had an idea of finding a instantly killing suicide method (I used cuffs) combined with a suicide vest with pipe bomb to kill a wizard.

I'm absolutely delighted that fell flat on it's face for you, because that is fucking awful. Suicide bombing is literally "hey you're an antagonist, i'm not so I have nothing to lose, lets both be miserable"
You could've ran up to him with a pipebomb in your hand and it would've achieved the same shitty effect. 

Yeah, I think it's perfectly reasonable for a suicide vest to work for suicides. Not much different than finding a russian revolver or eating a half-dozen lasers.

There's quite a difference, in that if you are stunned you cannot carry out your actions.

THAT SAID.. suicide vests go they could be done with some buffing. 
One of the main things is that it should arm when put on you, and while you can take it off, anybody else who tries to strip it from you will cause it to explode. This will prevent scenarios where you're all "give me money or i explode" and you get tazed and harmlessly stripped.
The suicide bomb vest could also do with remote signalers being attached to it, just incase you want to rig an area with TTV's and go all out.
And yes, it should be able to accept the same containers as any beaker bomb.
But the fact it's not working with the suicide command is perfectly intentional

[Frank_Stein]

Suicide vests would be more interesting if they were more like generic wearable bombs. You could combine them with cuffs or straight jacket and make bombs you can strap into hostages instead of yourself. 

Also, the vests should require disarming before removal

[Vitatroll]

The topic isn't about bombing, its about suicide bombing, and the suicide vest. The difference is not subtle so stop derailing it.

Suicide bombing. If bombing isn't okay then suicide bombing isn't. In that case there is no difference. But yeah, derail over. I'm tired and got sidetracked. Also forgot that they worked with beakers until I reread this thread, which makes them weeey worse.

You're also right about the other methods of suicide. I was gonna change that but I wound up doing something first. You could still kill yourself with an injector belt while incapacitated but that requires setup.

[Superlagg]

Wouldn't it just be easier to cook off half a dozen breakers of blackpowder in your belt with a remote signaler? Even frees up a slot to wear a bedsheet and get a head start on being a ghost.

Way I always thought of these vests was as a defensive taking-u-with-me device, not as a proactive suicide bomb. I think it has the wrong name here, it seems more like a deadman's switch that you use to discourage dying in the first place.

[TheOnlyRyan]

I'm absolutely delighted that fell flat on it's face for you, because that is fucking awful. Suicide bombing is literally "hey you're an antagonist, i'm not so I have nothing to lose, lets both be miserable"
You could've ran up to him with a pipebomb in your hand and it would've achieved the same shitty effect. 

I should have said that I didnt try it on a wizard, I was standing in the pool after calling a massive crowd to witness the fun. Only for there to be no fun and just a brainless corpse floating in the pool. I then learnt there wasnt even a wizard that round, so fun times. 

As for people saying no because it will be used offensively, pretty sure the percentage of offensive suicide bomb attacks vastly outweighs defensive at the moment, the middle east and all. 

Being able to hook a suicide vest onto a hostage and have them handcuffed to a chair would be spectacular. I definitely like the idea of it going off if someone tries to remove it too, though the player would need to choose what kind they want before hand, a defensive vest thats activated ondeath/takingoff or by a switch/signal.

I don't want to give too many elaborate ideas because you just have to take a quick look at the vast amount of ideas and suggestions that have plenty of yes's but nothings been done because coders simply dont have the time. It wouldn't take 10 minutes to make vests operate on death and on command which is why I think it would be easy to test and implement. Afterwards we can determine if its fun or good and how to expand on it.

I'd like this thread to be focused on the idea of for now, just having suicide jackets operate on suicide / with a button to press. Players griefing with it shouldnt be a reason to say no because they shouldnt be griefing in the first place.

[NateTheSquid]

Alright so I was there for the pool thing, I think the suicide vest worked as planned. Hear me out. When you pulled out your skull with handcuffs, a message was displayed in chat. It said something like: "The suicide vest beeps/flashes/something for a second, but nothing happens". If it didn't set off from the suicide command, I think it wouldn't do anything. Also suicide vests are made, in real life, to go off when your pulse gets too low. The suicide vests in game are made with health analyzers so they should be triggered by your pulse as well. Or the closest thing goon has, being are you dead or not.