I don't like off-station crimes and I can't describe why

[Gomp]

I think jailbird would be a lot less of an issue if there was some sort of BIG disclaimer telling people they will get treated like they committed the crime and they need to comply with security. Though after typing that I don't quite understand what the point of the trait is, even if it is played as intedended.

[JanusRose]

Jailbirds arriving as convicts would be cool. Maybe they'd have different sentences instead of "having to pay off a debt". And maybe the convicts could be a few different types.

Normal convicts who are serving a sentence by being in the brig for some type, maybe spawn with one random item on their person to help. Convict with a death sentence, perhaps these prisoners did a more heinous space crime and have a limited time to escape or accept their fate.

And maybe a mutant convict, some weird mutant prisoner that at least for rp reasons isn't treated like a prisoner and is sort of a nanotrasen secret project. I guess this deviates from the initial jailbird trait, but maybe this would be cool.

[Lefinch]

Jailbirds arriving as convicts would be cool. Maybe they'd have different sentences instead of "having to pay off a debt". And maybe the convicts could be a few different types.

Normal convicts who are serving a sentence by being in the brig for some type, maybe spawn with one random item on their person to help. Convict with a death sentence, perhaps these prisoners did a more heinous space crime and have a limited time to escape or accept their fate.

And maybe a mutant convict, some weird mutant prisoner that at least for rp reasons isn't treated like a prisoner and is sort of a nanotrasen secret project. I guess this deviates from the initial jailbird trait, but maybe this would be cool.

Perhaps extremely unfairly: I would dismiss this or any "deliberate method of ending up in the brig as prisoner" idea out of hand simply because a majority of people who seem to ask for it are people who really either struggle to remain unbanned or are getting banned because they struggle with basic rules. No thank you. No thank you forever. No thank you in general.

Slightly more fair reasoning: The -useful- thing about jailbird right now is that security can logically and reasonably elect to focus on antagonists (of whom's moment to be in the limelight is now and something they may have had to wait some time for) rather than off-station crimes (which would be every single round with a trait like this) when things are crazy/busy. This is a bit harder to ignore without some cognitive dissonance of turfing "prisoners" every round.

[Vulwin_Gilran]

I have been reading through alot of concerns, and even considering my own previous concerns I stated. I feel that this isn't a thing that would get fixed by removing/modifying the trait, as people who want to tide/selfantag are going to regardless of if they have the funny arrest status start trait. My opinion is to ahelp when people are shit, even if its just when you saw the end credits and realised that dude who broke into the brig five times and stole sec gear that round wasnt an antag. as far as im aware, ahelps can always still be submitted after a round has happened as long as you can provide [server] [time] [timezone] [offender] [actions] since they do have logs of the rounds.

As a summary i feel like most of the displeasure with the trait is the shitty behaviour from people regardless of the presence of the trait and I feel changing/removing it wouldn't address the real problem.