an idea on how to jazz up conspirator

[DisturbHerb]

it's your friendly neighbourhood conspiracy complaint thread!

i've got an idea tell me what y'all think

conspirator is an antag that heavily depends on co-operation, and it's hard to get a good degree of co-operation sometimes. i think a big reason why is that, well, many of the objectives simply aren't that great. because objectives aren't mandatory, it's not uncommon for a good chunk of the conspiracy to just give up and do their own thing.

to foster a greater degree of cooperation and to get people on the same page without railroading them too hard into a specific path, i propose replacing objectives with "motivations"; basically a little backstory to drive the round's conflict. i want to answer why there's a conspiracy afoot in the first place, and the conspirators can develop their own objectives using that motivation as a guide.

example, maybe the conspirators are fuming due to intrusive austerity measures and budget cuts. this gives them a grievance to grapple onto while also giving them the flexibility to create and adapt objectives to their liking. i'm hoping this'll reduce the number of people giving up on their objectives because they don't like 'em, as ideally you'd create objectives that you want to accomplish in the first place.

of course if you shove this idea into a conspirator rework alone, it probably won't hold up on its own, and many others have already talked at length about what else could be changed.

it's 1 in the mornign

[Cal]

Yeah if you wanna do more in-depth 'objectives' framed to let people play around more it sounds good to me

[Kotlol]

I once again refer to my "voting system" idea at round start.

Since conspirators are EXCLUSIVELY round start antagonists.
I think they should get a pop up window where they can vote in the 1st 5 minutes wich objective to go for.
Majority vote wins, you get a small stash of items to help your crew out at your meeting grounds. (Will be set depending on objective)
If all conspirators vote, they can instantly pick it up. It will be a stealth storage FYI.

Now they won't get anything crazy... but like a small surplus of items (normal and possible antag) to get their plans going smoothly.

For example you get 3 possible objectives:
- Hold an Illegal Bingo tournament. (Get bingo machine, bingo prize, bingo cards, PDA module: "Bingo")
- Start to coupe to overthrow current Command (Get weapons, get flimsy armor, get "break in tools")
- Make someone patient zero of an epidemic (Get chemicals, get hacker hypospray, get "disease item")

That kinda stuff.. it won't be just those 3.. it will cycle between different ones, but it will always be "Silly" "Aggresive" and "Hysteria" based.

This is just an idea.

[colossusqw]

For me, a thing i'd like to see would be less command members and detectives on conspiracies, and perhaps a more departmental version of a conspiracy.
So instead of, for instance, a conspiracy composed by a HoP that's gonna give AA to everyone, a detective that's gonna use all their gear for extra chaos, and two assistant basically extras, you get all of botany scheeming or the bartender, chef and some assistants.
I'd much rather have less very well equiped roles giving all conspirators command or sec stuff to their co-conspirators, and much more department scaled conspiracies, it would make them less potentially volatile as they currently are, and give the conspirators a cool theme to go with.

[Kotlol]

For me, a thing i'd like to see would be less command members and detectives on conspiracies, and perhaps a more departmental version of a conspiracy.
So instead of, for instance, a conspiracy composed by a HoP that's gonna give AA to everyone, a detective that's gonna use all their gear for extra chaos, and two assistant basically extras, you get all of botany scheeming or the bartender, chef and some assistants.
I'd much rather have less very well equiped roles giving all conspirators command or sec stuff to their co-conspirators, and much more department scaled conspiracies, it would make them less potentially volatile as they currently are, and give the conspirators a cool theme to go with.

One time I had the RD, 2 scientist and 1 Engineer (and one staffy but they went into cryo right away) as the conspiracy.
Did it go anywhere? Well sorta.. we had a base, but... turns out our kidnapping ploy to take over the station... sorta didn't happen since the cap died.. the hop vanished.. and the RD just got a hold of the cap's ID and was announced captain... we put budget into science.. no one questioned it and the round ended (SAD)

[Scaltra]

This may be a bit more out there of an idea that captures the crew's attention. Sometimes they just ignore things and it turns out it was too minor. Sometimes no one comes to the bee party or comes to the protest for a bee cuddling room or for higher pay outside of command. Even some of the conspirators don't show up.

I feel like no matter what we do there won't be a way to gareentee that the objectives or what people come up with will be fun and work for them or the crew.

I feel like an interesting thing we could try though is focusing more on the cohesion of the group? Something that tells the players pr binds them together to try and help each other at the very least. Still leaves the possibility people band together on one thing or not.

I have found conspirator can be fun in a semi solo sense if people are willing to at least work together and help eachother instead of ignoring their fellow co conspirators.

That being said a ranked choice voting system where each player enters in ideas they have come up with in 5 minutes or so and everyone votes on the other persons could work too! I think maybe like one canned objective as an option in a vote could be interesting too.

It is hard because people can vary a lot and conspirator is all about forming a team and a common goal normally.

[DisturbHerb]

I feel like an interesting thing we could try though is focusing more on the cohesion of the group? Something that tells the players pr binds them together to try and help each other at the very least. Still leaves the possibility people band together on one thing or not.

the cohesion issue is what i've tried to address with my suggestion: have everyone on mostly the same page while also encouraging them to form goals and objectives that would suit the situation and the group.

idk about you but all this voting stuff seems to be supplanting the "physically meeting in a dank corner of maintenance to debate over what to do" sorta thing that i really crave in this gamemode

[Scaltra]

idk about you but all this voting stuff seems to be supplanting the "physically meeting in a dank corner of maintenance to debate over what to do" sorta thing that i really crave in this gamemode

Yeah, I really like this part of it. I am not really suggesting getting rid of it. More so one possible thing we could do is have a system in place that would get everyone on the same page when they are there so they can talk about their ideas, come to a decision or a few they like and then have a vote on those. This is something I have organically done in some of my conspirator games narrowing down the options based on what we all want and then taking a vote on some of the specifics we might not completely agree on. 

So I guess a way to initiate a vote? Would be cool while at the meeting spot. 

I also really like the idea of backgrounds over suggested gimmicks because I do think a lot of them aren't all that great. 

I think part of the pop-up should stress helping your co-conspirators though I have had somewhere people semi-do their own thing but help you with the main one or your idea and it can be really nice when that happens as well.

[Lord_earthfire]

Personally, i think objectives are only a suggestion if you're not creative. And while the meeting place often doesm't work that well, i found the com channel for conspirators being the most valuable asset that allows them to decide on an objective nd coordinate it.

Conspirators are special because they exist between multiple departments, enabling them to do wicked stuff a single department couldn't pull off. I recall a round where having a botanist and a engineer enabled us to create a giant boidome (sadly, we made it much roo huge and it was only ready just before the round ended). So i am especially agaibst constraining conspirators to non-command departments or only single departments.

Having that said, i live the idea of giving sone background to the conspiracy. Give them objectives as a suggestion, but also give them sone background.

[Frank_Stein]

I feel like an interesting thing we could try though is focusing more on the cohesion of the group? Something that tells the players or binds them together to try and help each other at the very least. Still leaves the possibility people band together on one thing or not.

I agree with this sentiment. A clear chain of command should be established, even if that means just designating someone the "Head Conspirator" with the only difference being they're expected to settle group disputes and lead the action.

It could be fun to give Conspirator some kind of items both to help build team cohesion, or even to help prompt a plan.
For instance, they could spawn with a photograph of someone else in the round. No additional instructions, just a picture to roleplay off of. Could be anything... an unpaid Hospital Bill, a blood stained letter, an ID with your face but a different name. Anything that implies intrigue

Let the conspirators have fun trying to tie all their items into one cohesive conspiracy against them

[Scaltra]

I agree with this sentiment. A clear chain of command should be established, even if that means just designating someone the "Head Conspirator" with the only difference being they're expected to settle group disputes and lead the action.

I didn't really think of a chain of command, that is an interesting idea though. I really like the evenness of the choice of voting but having one person who is meant to be a rallying figure for the group can be good. 

I am not personally opposed to people doing their own things. I think it can sometimes be fun as long as the conspirators still work together and help each other with said things. That is what makes conspirator cool to me. The cool things you can do together as a team. Sometimes it functions the same way even when you all are working towards the same thing. Sometimes the tasks are atomized in such a way you are all working on different things but towards the same goal. 

Sometimes you are all working on the same thing as an efficient direct path force. Other times you are all on different projects but your own expertise and abilities in each others department can help one another out. 

It isn't the conspirator games where we have different goals that I necessarily find unfun but the games where people refuse to work together at all and ignore each other and I am either trying to throw that suprise party on my own or with one other person or everyone split and it's basically solo hardmode traitor.

I love the idea of adding items they can roleplay off of to help come up with ideas together. That sounds amazing.