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+--- Thread: More goodies for the Cairngorm (/showthread.php?tid=15484)
More goodies for the Cairngorm - Mouse - 12-02-2020
At first, the Cairngorm was filled with various odds and ends designed to make a nukie's life easier (or more painful, in the case of the sarin). Many of these have been removed due to various balance or game design decisions, and the Cairngorm is starting to feel a bit anemic. The tactical fanny packs were removed when the tokens were introduced. Most of the (thoroughly excessive number of) medkits were recently removed. The sarin crate and the atropine syringes were removed when sarin nades became a utility item. The sleepy pen seems to have vanished somewhere at some point. I feel like I'm forgetting a few although I'm not quite sure what they are. (The SWAT masks and the donk pockets never made it to the Cairngorm, and apparently the former was just readded anyways?)
I figured I'd make some suggestions for more stuff to put on the Cairngorm for thematic, QoL, or customization options.
- The tactical fanny packs, removing them as a utility purchase. The additional inventory space is such a major bonus that it's hard to justify taking any other utility item, especially if you chose heavy, marksman, or god forbid firebrand and either have to do obnoxious juggling to use your backpack or (in the case of the firebrand) just straight up be required to leave it behind. (Alternately, you could ditch the sidearm belts and have the sidearms and their ammo spawn in a tactical fanny pack. That honestly might be the better solution, particularly for newbies who try to wear the sidearm belt as if it's at all useful)
- Fire extinguishers. IIRC the Cairngorm doesn't have any, meaning that if you get set on fire you better hope someone picked medic. Give the medic a special high-capacity extinguisher or just ditch it entirely if you do this. Medic inventory management hurts.
- More landmines, and varied types of such. There's stun and radiation already in the game, and they make defending more fun, at least in my opinion. This would require landmines to be fixed, since they're currently bugged.
- More NVGs. Apparently there's only three of them? Give us enough for the whole squad.
- A power sink. Quite possibly the most commonly used item if you don't buy a loadout. Lets the team use a power sink without someone having to give up on having a sweet gun and suit. Alternately, this could be a utility purchase.
- A few more medkits. The number that the Cairngorm used to have was clearly excessive, but as near as I can tell there's only like, two regular medkits left. That's barely enough for surgery. I don't like feeling pressured to take medic because that's the only way anyone is going to get healed and I don't know if I can trust whoever took medic to not space themselves by accident or run off and get killed.
- Bring back the atropine syringes. Making the sarin grenade a utility item only doesn't really seem to have toned down much on its use, and now there's no defense short of having a medic. They're also useful for staying up when everything's been overrun and you're in crit. You almost certainly won't be able to change the outcome, but someone being up and fighting as the nuke gets smashed makes things more fun for both sides IMO.
- Table parts. They're an integral part of nukie strategy, and having some loose table parts will save a bit of time when preparing and I figure newbies are more likely to figure tables out of their own if there's loose parts in the Cairngorm. You could also reflavor and resprite them. Why use boring old tables when you can use sandbags or hedgehogs?
- Another syndicate omnitool or two. Saves on inventory space, especially with the engineer.
- A box of mousetraps. DIY landmines when combined with grenades!
- A heavy duty crowbar that can pry open powered (but not bolted) doors or flip over vending machines etc. for makeshift barricades. Might work better in a kit or as a utility item, however.
- Tactical burritos. It's still funny, and people still take the burrito for no apparent reason, so why not enshrine it?
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - Boxta - 12-02-2020
+1 to all of these, Espically the table parts, powersink might needa be a utiitly item tho
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - Gannets - 12-03-2020
I'll have a look at a couple of these.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - GORE - 12-03-2020
Nukies should work for getting a few simple metal plates and craft the tables on the spot - ON STATION.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - Sundance - 12-03-2020
Keep in mind that some goodies were specifically taken away for balance reasons, leaning towards the weapon sets to fill in the blanks.
The Fanny Pack
Inventory management is a balance purpose. You don't want the syndies to have an absolute arsenal of weaponry hence the restriction.
That said, I agree on the basis that in their current form, there's simply not enough room and fanny pack almost seems a given choice, even with the tacticool backpack with more space. I would recommend that syndies are given a security pocket pouch. It doesn't make the fanny pack obsolete, but it makes it less of a given.
Fire extinguishers
Agree on this. This is something that is simply stolen when on station, it just creates an unnecessary task.
More landmines
Agree on this. They're not really used that much. Giving them more (or even better, giving them a box to save space, hint hint) would encourage them to be taken.
More NVGs
Disagree on this. Sometimes less is more here. The infiltrator comes with this in their set. The spare NVG is for a player who doesn't want to roll infiltrator but wants to do something similar.
A power sink
Hard pass on this. Powersinks are exceptionally debilitating to the crew (sec can't charge their weapons!) along with driving the AI mad. It is too good an item to simply have at round start, it needs to be an option.
A few more medkits.
Neutral on this. Define a "few more". This was already a thing prior but was removed on the basis that if you want to keep your troops healed, better pick a medic. Less is more, but I wouldn't be totally against it so medic isn't a complete necessity. Having it so that every nuke op has a medpak/menders just tips the favor too much in favor of the nukies imo, better to strike a balance.
Bring back the atropine syringes.
Again, neutral on this. Getting shot to bits and getting put into crit is fair game. I would not be against the atropine syringes (1, singular!) with the sarin nades.
Table parts, Another syndicate omnitool or two, A box of mousetraps.
Agree on all these things. They're either unnecessary busywork (ripping up tables in the main room), useful items that get you out of (or into) a pinch (omnitool) or just good for subterfuge with a bit of prep (mousetraps).
A heavy duty crowbar that can pry open powered (but not bolted) doors or flip over vending machines etc. for makeshift barricades.
This sounds like a halfway-house emag with a bunch of features taken out. I'd like this as a utility item, so long as it doesn't work like an emag (as in, it breaks the doors). Could be used to immediately deconstruct tables too. Naturally, it should be pretty robust as a melee item. I think with all these things would make it a pretty good choice.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - Frank_Stein - 12-03-2020
I think some of these things could be solved with expanding the utility options. Some single use syringes with okay healing and stun/pain reducing chems would be a good option.
Maybe have a group token that can be spent on one big purchase for the whole team, say on things like a powersink or pod upgrades, etc. Stuff built towards very specific gameplans.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - GORE - 12-03-2020
An extra token for the commander to use in consideration with their team sounds good.
In that case I would be alright with a large set of tables in a crate and other utility stuff.
Because Nukies are already in a good state balance wise.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - BatElite - 12-03-2020
Isn't the pyro fire axe intended as a way to smash in airlocks? I'm worried the crowbar thing will both push the pyro into the "team safety hazard" niche and deminish what use powersinks have for nukie mobility. Flipping vending machines sounds fun (although anyone can pull them at that point), maybe some of this can be worked into the engineer's wrench?
I'm not well versed in nukie balance, but maybe a decent idea is to give them some bottles & syringes of the less potent/slow acting chems (salycilic acid, menthol, potassium iodide) to bolster their capacity for surgery, but are bulky on precious inventory space otherwise.
Also aren't powersinks available through the custom loadout uplink thingy? If we're going into group purchases though, I think a "give up your utility/sidearm credit for the communal pot" system would be nicer than giving the commander an extra token.
I don't really feel like nukies should have everything they could possibly need given to them ono the cairngorm, there's something to be said for having them have to raid for some things or make fortifications on the spot.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - Frank_Stein - 12-04-2020
(12-03-2020, 02:13 PM)BatElite Wrote: I don't really feel like nukies should have everything they could possibly need given to them ono the cairngorm, there's something to be said for having them have to raid for some things or make fortifications on the spot.
I agree with this. Nukie gear should be built towards building a team with a specific strength, but always limited by what they can carry and never enough to cover every angle.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - Sundance - 12-05-2020
+1 on Bats comment.
That said, my nitpicking was leaning towards this. Items that could be given I feel are busy-body items. Good nukies will be ripping up tables already, so why not just give them unconstructed? Same goes for items that could be pilfered.
Giving them stuff like powersinks is on the other end of the spectrum.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - KikiMofo - 12-05-2020
A button that when pressed just sarin gasses the entire cruiser. Ends the same way every game ends when you see that someone opened the sarin box.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - GORE - 12-16-2020
Give the commander an extra token to spent for granting the whole team extra utility goodies. Such a token could be used for stuff like the following:
-Fire extinguisher kit with extra fire dmg medkits
-Two crates of generic medkits
-A crate of table sets
-A teleportable locker with a remote. Similar to the Port-A-Sci but only able to transport items. Solving many storage problems for Nukies while having to bring their locker to the battlefield for extra gear. Granting crew a shot to steal that gear.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - RGBDeadSilent - 12-16-2020
I recently made my own thread without having seen this one apparently. I agree, we need more equipment re-added to the Cairngorm. The lack of Atropine for the crew is really debilitating when someone messes up a sarin grenade, and the already lacking inventory space causes me to almost always have to purchase the tactical fanny pack, i'm just going to go ahead and agree with everything thats on this list. The Power Sink is a bit OP, but as the person who routinely purchases a custom link just to infiltrate with a DNA Scram to power sink, please give me more TC by just having on on the battle cruiser.
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - Studenterhue - 12-16-2020
Recently, Gannets has decided to add some of the things mentioned here to the Cairngorm. Nothing too crazy and none of the custom item ideas for now (but maybe in the future), but do note:
-Some utility belts have been replaced with syndicate omnitools
-Four extinguishers were added
-There's now an entire crate with atropine auto-injectors
-A couple of table and similar furniture parts can appear in the storage area below the pod bay (you know, that place with the bagpipes)
RE: More goodies for the Cairngorm - GORE - 12-16-2020
You know what?
I would actually be in favor of adding random spawners with specific items.
Like - you know'em clothing and trash spawners?
How about some random table spawners; here we might get 0-8 table sets.
Here we might get 2-6 fire extinguishers.
Here we might get 1-3 omni-tools.
I like RNG.