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+--- Thread: Nerf the robustec (/showthread.php?tid=12578)
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Nerf the robustec - moistgrandmas42 - 07-16-2019
For something that can be grabbed in less than 2 minutes, the robustec implant provides way too much utility for the amount of effort it requires. You can shrug off any minor damage with them, and spacewalk without a suit for a non-trivial amount of time with it. I honestly consider it better than the SOS which requires running lava moon all the way through.
One way to nerf it would be to make medbots anchored (so you can't shove them around or walk through them) and/or inject faster. I feel like this fits better thematically as well than a direct nerf to it's effect. By anchoring, you'd actually have to deal with them or they'll eventually corner you, and they're some of the toughest mobs in the game. Even the bots in the biodome drone ship or at the end of the void take less shots to down. The medibots should be more threatening considering what they guard. Right now the bots aren't anchored which makes it trivial to dodge them and keep a one square gap to avoid injections. The robustec is simply too good for the amount of time and trivial risk that it takes to get, and you get two of them + grenade kit!
Also, is it intended to give constant regen instead of only under 40%? It currently gives you passive regen regardless of your current hp.
RE: Nerf the robustec - Vextrom - 07-16-2019
I agree with the sentiment of nerfing it, though it's hard for me to say what the correct way to go about it is. I think I would advocate for either making it harder to obtain or nerfing the effects, but not both.
RE: Nerf the robustec - moistgrandmas42 - 07-16-2019
Oh for sure, I was just throwing out multiple suggestions on ways that it could be nerfed indirectly. I'd really go with nerfing the difficulty to obtain it or the effect. Not both.
RE: Nerf the robustec - Flaborized - 07-17-2019
Yeah, the robusttec is really strong for how easy it is to get. In my opinion it should have some sort of major drawback that makes using it a trade-off or it shouldn't be where it is because it takes less than five minutes to grab it and the payout is too good for the relatively low risk getting it presents.
RE: Nerf the robustec - KikiMofo - 07-17-2019
I thought the robusttec was only suppose to work if you are hurt a lot and then it gives you healing chems to keep you from dying?
RE: Nerf the robustec - Zamujasa - 07-18-2019
I shared a few ideas for robuttsec changes in Discord:
- Make them dispense chems only when below 100% HP
- Implant has an internal small auto-charging battery
- Dispensing chems drains the battery; going into crit drains more chems (= more battery drain)
- Getting tazed or shocked will also drain it and disable it for a few seconds - two or three taser bolts should fully drain it
- EMPs make them short out and zap you or cause a minor explosion
Alternatively, make them run off the user's stamina, in much the same way as the internal battery idea, as if it's drawing power from you to power itself. Comes with a built-in tradeoff in that taking constant minor damage will drain stamina and eventually cause you to just run out.
RE: Nerf the robustec - moistgrandmas42 - 07-18-2019
According to the wiki it should only heal you if you're under 40% or deep crit for the big boost. At the moment it gives you 20 omnizine every 30s or so regardless of your current hp. It's a bit powerful...
RE: Nerf the robustec - aft2001 - 07-18-2019
I quite like Zamujasa's proposals, and I'd just like to add another:
Have the implant be activated via the abilities bar in the top left, much like your PDA flashlight or vampire abilities. This would require you to be conscious, and it should have a cooldown.
With this proposal specifically, this would make the implant more of a tool than a passive protection against being-dead, and it would require some strategy - do you use your implant to heal your moderate damage to get you back up to full speed so you can escape, or should you wait to use it to maximize its potential due to its long cooldown?
RE: Nerf the robustec - Triacontakai - 07-18-2019
(07-18-2019, 11:23 AM)Zamujasa Wrote: Alternatively, make them run off the user's stamina, in much the same way as the internal battery idea, as if it's drawing power from you to power itself. Comes with a built-in tradeoff in that taking constant minor damage will drain stamina and eventually cause you to just run out.
i think this is a really good idea
makes for an interesting mechanic where the omnizine makes you harder to kill, but you may also be unconscious for longer because of stamina loss from someone beating you, with the implant taking the stamina to recharge
RE: Nerf the robustec - Prichard - 07-18-2019
Hide it
RE: Nerf the robustec - cyberTripping - 07-19-2019
(07-18-2019, 10:22 PM)Prichard Wrote: Hide it
Theres not really many places i can think of where hiding something there could amount to something, given how powerful telescience is.
edit: while i dont know where the hell this thing is, i guess something that would achieve the same function as hiding it is making it appear in one of several locations, which would slow down efforts to get it. That being said, that's just a thought, I still dont think hiding it would be sufficient as a nerf since it doesnt address the underlying issues with its power.
RE: Nerf the robustec - Haprenti - 07-19-2019
Move it to a Z5 location
RE: Nerf the robustec - aft2001 - 07-19-2019
I think that reworks take more effort but typically achieve better results, whereas easy tweaks (moving the robust-tec, for example) usually just improves balance, but not as much as reworks can.
Since a rework would take time, perhaps it would be wise to temporarily relocate the robust-tec to a more difficult-to-access location? As it stands, the current danger you are exposed to when acquiring the robust-tec implants is moderate, but low if you know what you're doing. As the Robust-Tec is a powerful implant, it should be more difficult to acquire, for sure, rather than simply relocated - as soon as the first person finds it and tells everyone where it is, then we're back to square 1. Getting to where the implant is should be fairly easy - actually getting in there and making it out with the implant, alive, is the hard part.
My current possible propositions (so, not having to use them all) for making the robust-tec harder to acquire are as follows:
1) Make acquiring it time-sensitive. You would only have a certain amount of time before something happens (e.g a self-destruct sequence initiates on the ship it's in, and by accessing the room it's in, you inherently trigger this sequence), or you have to restart if you mess up/don't complete the puzzle/problem in time.
2) Randomization. Enough to the point where you don't know exactly what you have to prepare to handle, but not too much to the point where it's just utterly unpredictable and impossible to prepare for. I'm not sure how this could work, but perhaps relocating the implant to a station/structure in the debris field which has a randomly determined layout, hazards, and treasure locations. I think that this latter option could be rather interesting - a maze/labyrinth of sorts which is unique from round to round, with new hazards and possibly loot that isn't guaranteed (e.g you may find a laser gun in a wall safe one round and some skulls in another round). The robust-tec would likely be located in an area that is themed around medicine/research and such, of course.
RE: Nerf the robustec - moistgrandmas42 - 07-19-2019
I really think as a short term fix to the robustec should be buffing the medbots. It would make the robustec a lot harder to acquire while not requiring a rework of a similar area. The fact that you can move through them renders the medbots a joke because of their AI's patterns. By making their mob anchored, you'd actually have to deal with the medbots unless you want to be trapped by them. While I'm sure they could be cheesed, the medbots would actually be a significant threat compared to what they're now.
RE: Nerf the robustec - Haprenti - 07-19-2019
I feel like making it harder to access in a given location would just make it nerd-restricted (or group restricted). Nerds would still be able to get it alone consistently somehow with optimized strats, just slighlty slower depending on how it's done. Yet if they can do that, they're probably the ones that need it the least unless it can be totally cheesed.
Moving it to somewhere in Z5 turns it into a nice non-garanteed reward for exploration among other things, protects it from almost direct telescience, protects it from being found at roundstart, and more importantly doesn't lock it up behind a nerd/group only wall.
More love for Z5. If it's so good that you really don't want its location randomized, and want to be sure it's obtainable, that's one more clue as to why its location should be randomized.