+- Goonstation Forums (https://forum.ss13.co)
+-- Forum: Discussion (https://forum.ss13.co/forumdisplay.php?fid=6)
+--- Forum: Ideas & Suggestions (https://forum.ss13.co/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+--- Thread: Give security belts (/showthread.php?tid=5145)
Re: Give security belts - Dr_Bee - 07-19-2015
To people saying that this would screw with game balance, there is currently nothing stopping security guards from grabbing a tool belt and filling it with cuffs and flash-bangs. the addition of a special security belt would basically just be a quality of life improvement over a balance one. plus it would leave more tool belts for everyone else.
Re: Give security belts - Frank_Stein - 07-19-2015
My default Sec loadup is taser on belt, PDA on the ID slot, flash and airtank in pocket. I stick everything else in the box other than some cuffs, my baton, and maybe a flashbang if I think I might need it. I don't really worry too much about PDA bombs since as long as I'm not the first one to get bombed, I usually have enough time to turn messaging off until it's over.
I say add belts, with the ability to put both the baton and a taser/phaser/e-gun/revolver on em, but stick them in the armory so HoS has to hand em out.
For the problem of handcuffs, add zip tie bundles to the regular Sec lockers. One bundle could be enough to handcuff maybe 6 people or so, and can be applied quicker. The trade-off is they have reduced time to remove them.
Re: Give security belts - Ed Venture - 07-19-2015
This is why I did not think there would be a balancing issue. At most I could see it only holding one taser or baton not both.
Dr_Bee Wrote:a special security belt would basically just be a quality of life improvement over a balance one. plus it would leave more tool belts for everyone else.
This was the very idea in a nutshell, to make item management easier on security and for the Heads of Security to stop wasting time with the handcuff boxes.
Sundance Wrote:For the naysayers:
It functions no differently than other belts. Medical and mining belt can hold larger objects of their job class that otherwise wouldn't fit in a box.
Furthermore, utility belts already function somewhat as a sec belt. They can hold small items, which means you can bring store cuffs, flashbangs, flashes and pdas. Adding in a belt that's restricted one weapon (gun or a baton) and giving it the ability to still receive messages from a pda would make item organisation far better.
Just like last time I feel Sundance's idea for the sec belt is the best way to go, the PDA idea along with the sec belt is a great idea.
Re: Give security belts - vampirate - 07-19-2015
The thing is you have two pockets, one belt loop and one backpack. that is a total of ten slots. A baton in the belt loop, the pda in the pocket still leaves eight. 2 pairs of cuffs, and one taser only further takes three slots in your backpack.bringing it down to five open slots. Say we use one pocket for emergency o2, that is four slots still free to carry medkits and whatnot. putting small items in the internals box lets you refresh supplies when need be. Inventory management is part of the game. Having to balance what you carry based on potential need is part of playing sec. That said for purposes of confiscating it wouldn't entirely suck to also be able to summon the evidence locker and send it back to sec.
Re: Give security belts - Ed Venture - 07-19-2015
vampirate Wrote:The thing is you have two pockets, one belt loop and one backpack. that is a total of ten slots. A baton in the belt loop, the pda in the pocket still leaves eight. 2 pairs of cuffs, and one taser only further takes three slots in your backpack.bringing it down to five open slots. Say we use one pocket for emergency o2, that is four slots still free to carry medkits and whatnot. putting small items in the internals box lets you refresh supplies when need be. Inventory management is part of the game. Having to balance what you carry based on potential need is part of playing sec. That said for purposes of confiscating it wouldn't entirely suck to also be able to summon the evidence locker and send it back to sec.
The thing is some security officers steal belts from engineers just for the sole purposes of carrying a few more handcuffs. I don't think security should be stealing from other departments and I really don't see why it's so wrong for security to have belts.
Re: Give security belts - misto - 07-19-2015
ive noticed fannypacks on the syndie nuke shuttle lately, i guess its inevitable that ppl will get jealous
i support belts/fannypacks for security
-precedent has been set by the presence of belts for other jobs
-its not like its unrealistic or anything, haw
-a bit of extra carrying capacity prrrobably wont make a shitty officer much worse, but would be a boon to a decent officer
-u can still put ur things in ur internals box if that is what u prefer
Re: Give security belts - Houka - 07-19-2015
I will say what I said when I was asked about this recently:
Security doesn't need a belt to do its job.
Engineering needs a belt because there are six standard tools as well as building materials and fire extinguishers and god knows what else that they need to juggle.
Mining gets a belt because they need room to fit their explosives, their hammer, their laser drill, their scanner, and they need it all somewhere that isn't a backpack that would fill up a hand slot.
Security needs a taser, a flash, a pair of handcuffs or three and their PDA, and that's about it. They can have more but it's not a requirement of the job. They don't NEED a belt because they aren't impeded. I am not arguing against the idea of giving security their own inventory item, but the servers I've seen secbelts on also have a shitload more tools to perform security tasks with than us because security in other servers is downright over-prepared for threats.
And consider how this could be abused. Do you really want a belt that anyone can wear, that can be stolen and filled with energy guns and used to keep the hands free of some spacesuit-wearing psychopath/vigilante? We don't really need a Space Punisher around the station, we get enough of that shit with the players who DON'T have a super convenient security utility belt to make their shittery easier.
Re: Give security belts - vampirate - 07-19-2015
To answer your spoiler Ed, I actually have a save slot 2 set up to put me in security when the population drops below 25, or at least add it to the list. When I'm playing I usually end up as sec once or twice a day. I've never needed more than I could carry to do my job. My job isn't to heal people, my job isn't to rebuild the station or be a hero.
I play sec as conflict resolution. I disperse disagreements or apprehend potential antags should someone call for help. I don't play hero sec, so my perspective is a bit different I suppose. two pockets, a belt slot and seven backpack slots leaves room for a few pairs of cuffs, a stun stick, a medkit, a flash and a taser with a slot or two left for various stuff. Is it going to leave you room for a full tool set and a ton of healing chems? No, and it bloody well shouldn't. Secs job is a simple one, and it's not to be the hero the station deserves. It's to keep the peace
Re: Give security belts - Ed Venture - 07-19-2015
Houka Wrote:Security doesn't need a belt to do its job.
No one said they need it, just that it would make some small annoying issues not so annoying
Quote:And consider how this could be abused. Do you really want a belt that anyone can wear, that can be stolen and filled with energy gun
If you read either thread and how we talked about how the belts should work you would know that this would not happen
Quote:We don't really need a Space Punisher around the station, we get enough of that shit with the players who DON'T have a super convenient security utility belt to make their shittery easier.
It really would not change how frequent we get those people at all.
Re: Give security belts - Ed Venture - 07-19-2015
vampirate Wrote:To answer your spoiler Ed, I actually have a save slot 2 set up to put me in security when the population drops below 25, or at least add it to the list. When I'm playing I usually end up as sec once or twice a day. I've never needed more than I could carry to do my job. My job isn't to heal people, my job isn't to rebuild the station or be a hero.
I play sec as conflict resolution. I disperse disagreements or apprehend potential antags should someone call for help. I don't play hero sec, so my perspective is a bit different I suppose. two pockets, a belt slot and seven backpack slots leaves room for a few pairs of cuffs, a stun stick, a medkit, a flash and a taser with a slot or two left for various stuff. Is it going to leave you room for a full tool set and a ton of healing chems? No, and it bloody well shouldn't. Secs job is a simple one, and it's not to be the hero the station deserves. It's to keep the peace
The med kit is for myself. Going around acting like a paramedic sec is a waste of time and would just get you killed. I think security should interact with the crew be it by helping them to med bay or engaging in a short conversation if nothing serious is going on. Maybe I'm just more of a people's person but I don't think being friendly makes me a "hero" by any means.
Re: Give security belts - misto - 07-19-2015
if its about -needing- belts to do yr job the only job that really needs theirs is mining, since their back is occupied by the jetpack and carrying your backpack in one hand is a great nuisance. i used to do all my engineer work with an internals box of tools in my backpack because i thought emergency oxygen tanks could only be put in the belt slot. now that i have noticed that the tank can fit in pockets, i have started to use a belt, and it has been a big plus.
Re: Give security belts - Ed Venture - 07-19-2015
It's not really about needing them to do the job. The fact some people think that's what we are saying is down right silly, it would just make things better and more convenient. I said we needed them in the OP but I used that word extremely loosely. Managing inventory and clicking and dragging the box is well a drag. Other people have made better arguments to why they would be a good addition in this thread and the old one. The two things I hear from the the people who don't like the idea is either "I don't like the idea" or "You don't need all that stuff to do your job" Sure you can get by with the bare minimum by just taking a taser and handcuffs or you can prepare for things by taking some extra handcuffs and some flashbangs. I just get the feeling you people think its bad to come prepared to situations
Re: Give security belts - UrsulaMejor - 07-19-2015
engineering never needs its tools in a hurry, and all are one handed.
engineering: belt slot oxy tank, pockets common tools (crowbar and wrench), pda in id slot, 4 tools in internals box, welder in backpack slot, and that leaves 5 slots open.
security often needs their tools immediately and without warning.
security: baton in belt slot, flash in pocket, handcuffs in pocket, two extra handcuffs in internals box, two extra flashbangs in internals box (optional), extra flash in internals box, taser in backpack slot, flashbang in backpack slot (optional), forensic scanner in backpack slot, leaving 4 (3)
with a utility belt and security belt they would equalize rather conveniently.
this isn't about whether either needs the extra space, it's about it being a really nice and cool and thematic quality of life suggestion
Re: Give security belts - vampirate - 07-20-2015
UrsulaMejor Wrote:engineering never needs its tools in a hurry, and all are one handed.
engineering: belt slot oxy tank, pockets common tools (crowbar and wrench), pda in id slot, 4 tools in internals box, welder in backpack slot, and that leaves 5 slots open.
security often needs their tools immediately and without warning.
security: baton in belt slot, flash in pocket, handcuffs in pocket, two extra handcuffs in internals box, two extra flashbangs in internals box (optional), extra flash in internals box, taser in backpack slot, flashbang in backpack slot (optional), forensic scanner in backpack slot, leaving 4 (3)
with a utility belt and security belt they would equalize rather conveniently.
this isn't about whether either needs the extra space, it's about it being a really nice and cool and thematic quality of life suggestion
I feel what you're saying. I think this is something that they could add to the sec vending machine with a cost of 10k. They've been looking for money spending suggestions and this would be a good one.
Re: Give security belts - Ed Venture - 07-20-2015
vampirate Wrote:UrsulaMejor Wrote:engineering never needs its tools in a hurry, and all are one handed.
engineering: belt slot oxy tank, pockets common tools (crowbar and wrench), pda in id slot, 4 tools in internals box, welder in backpack slot, and that leaves 5 slots open.
security often needs their tools immediately and without warning.
security: baton in belt slot, flash in pocket, handcuffs in pocket, two extra handcuffs in internals box, two extra flashbangs in internals box (optional), extra flash in internals box, taser in backpack slot, flashbang in backpack slot (optional), forensic scanner in backpack slot, leaving 4 (3)
with a utility belt and security belt they would equalize rather conveniently.
this isn't about whether either needs the extra space, it's about it being a really nice and cool and thematic quality of life suggestion
I feel what you're saying. I think this is something that they could add to the sec vending machine with a cost of 10k. They've been looking for money spending suggestions and this would be a good one.
I would totally be cool if officers had to buy the belt. Not sure if I agree on the price but it's a start