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Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Printable Version

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Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - BaneOfGiygas - 08-19-2015

I'm going to preface this by saying that I know that this is a pretty drastic change for what is probably a kind of flimsy reason, and you're free to shoot it down as hard as you like, I'd just like to bring this to the table.

As a veteran telesci nerd, I know the joy and wonder of being able to zap across space using portals and being able to grab all sorts of cool stuff, from the Captain's spare ID card to the AI to the drinks lined up at the bar. However, I feel like the ability to do this has drastically cheapened the allure of the mining z-level and the myriad wonders therein, because there's very little reason to actually go into space and go exploring yourself when you can just zap the loot straight onto your doorstep. And there's lots of loot to be found, from the NecroScan module to a chemgrenade kit to all sorts of crates filled with a whole bunch of shit. There's some pretty nifty stuff out there, and it kind of saddens me that the drive for exploration is lost as a result of telesci removing the need for actually GOING to places in order to get shit.

Due to this, I propose that there be an increase of telesci blocks across the mining z-level, for the primary purpose of encouraging that people actually go out there, find the shit, and brave whatever dangers may lie in wait instead of punching a few buttons into a console. It adds some actual challenge beyond that of mathematics to getting all of that cool stuff, and it will help give people a reason to climb into a pod and go exploring, which is something that I just about never see nowadays.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Roomba - 08-19-2015

I think a significant chunk of the debris field is already telesci-blocked. Also I don't really think this would increase exploring that much. Most of the people telesciencing the fancy stuff back already know where everything interesting is, so removing their ability to telesci it would just result in them beelining for them if they really want it, without very much exploration. I think the decrease in exploring the debris field is mostly because there hasn't been very much in the way of new stuff in it for a while, so everyone more or less knows what's out there. I don't think there's as big an overlap between the 'telesci stuff back' crowd and the exploration crowd as you imagine, really. You'd get decreased interest in the debris field all round - the same nerds interested in telesci can also generally brave the debris field with little difficulty, and casual explorers/budding telescientists get annoyed at all the secrecy and nerfing and leave to do something else.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Grayshift - 08-19-2015

The difficulty in telesciencing debris field loot for yourself comes from actually securing telescience. Waiting your turn while some amateur telesci operator burns down the telepad and flatlines the battery is pretty commonplace. None of the loot is particularly grand, truthfully.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - I-Sett - 08-19-2015

Most of the stuff that can be easily abused is reserved for the Adventure/Centcomm z-level. You know, the one COMPLETELY blocked from telesci abuse (mostly). If you want to start arbitrarily blocking the stuff that is much less interesting just so people go out and spend time collecting it then you may as well remove the ability of telescience to transport anything other than humans/borgs entirely.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Frank_Stein - 08-19-2015

Roomba Wrote:I think the decrease in exploring the debris field is mostly because there hasn't been very much in the way of new stuff in it for a while, so everyone more or less knows what's out there.
I think that's the problem there, more than anything.

I had an idea before that the wreckage in the debris Z-level have ladders, which going down takes you to another dungeon z-level composed of blocked off rooms. The ladders in the debris field and it's corresponding ladder in the dungeon z-level would be randomized at round start to make it a less predictable experience.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - BaneOfGiygas - 08-19-2015

Yeah, upon further consideration and it not being five in the morning, the lack of noteworthy loot is probably much more of a contributing factor than the telesci thing. I dunno, I've always been a fan of the sense of adventure and such, and I just about never see that with the debris field. Maybe once Cogmap2 hits it'll be something that'll come back up, but I dunno. I just thought it was something to bring to attention.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Mofleaker - 08-19-2015

I think it would be neat if the debris field were semi-randomly generated on a grid. For example you might have the listening post in the bottom right on one round, the top left in another, and in a different round it doesn't even spawn at all.

I'd also love to see ye olde space adventure locations make a comeback by being added into the mix. Let's go exploring dilapidated Zeta and the russian zombie station!

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Vitatroll - 08-19-2015

Yeah. The thread brings up a good point. The derelict-z is lacking a proper draw. Adding new stuff would certainly help, but only for a week or so. It would also mean additional z-levels as the current setup is pretty comfortable space-wise. We wouldn't want the derelict z to be so full of stuff that it feels cluttered.

My own opinion is that the easiest fix is a change to the constant nature of loot, and the danger associated with gathering that loot. Basically, loot chests with loot lists corresponding to the dangers faced. It could range from clothing on low lists to low/med level syndicate items on higher lists. Some old places would probably need more critters, and some new, more dangerous places would probably need to be added, though.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - BaneOfGiygas - 08-20-2015

Vitatroll Wrote:Basically, loot chests with loot lists corresponding to the dangers faced. It could range from clothing on low lists to low/med level syndicate items on higher lists. Some old places would probably need more critters, and some new, more dangerous places would probably need to be added, though.
Well, this is probably what the abandoned crates are supposed to be, but no one ever seems to go through the trouble of unlocking those things and you typically just end up getting a bunch of cats when you do, so the loot could stand to be more useful instead of being the gamut of medical supply beakers, hobo wine, and Discount Dan snack cakes.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Marquesas - 08-20-2015

BaneOfGiygas Wrote:typically just end up getting a bunch of cats when you do

Due to the way it's randomized you have a pretty hefty chance of getting a Voltron.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Noah Buttes - 08-20-2015

I really think the main problem is the lack of noteworthy loot.
Here's some (hopefully easy to implement) ideas to alleviate this issue:
  • Make the orange-tinted sunglasses work like old style thermals
  • Make the abandoned crate loot table less ridiculous, fewer voltrons, more exotic treasures.
  • Tone down some of the drones (especially the HK-drones, jesus)
  • Add more merchants
  • Make it so the daily special sold by the diner bot actually changes
  • Add more small loot, like ??? pills, cannabis leaves, gold star stickers, etc
  • Make the mining outpost public access
  • Fix the botanical mister (how is this thing STILL broken?)
  • Add some capsule machines to various places in the z-level
  • Make the strange pod part work like it used to
  • Put some actual loot on the drone husk/z-drone hangar/the big syndicate thing with the zappy bots
  • Hide a rainbow toy sword in the fermid nest
  • Hiding a capsule with a guaranteed rare figure in the fermid nest
  • Sticking an extra large capacity camera on the tourist shuttle
  • Hiding a gangster outfit in the smuggler's cache
  • Hiding a fruit hat somewhere. Possibly even randomly on the z-level
  • Put another chocolate gateau randomly in one of the various kitchens.
  • Hide things in toilets, why do none of the toilets anywhere EVER HIDE ANYTHING!?
  • Make thrown bricks break windows really easily
  • Make the clown car repairable
  • Put a batman costume on the security shuttle
  • Put a sack on the christmas shuttle, you can stuff an endless amount of gift-wrapped items in it and randomly draw one out
  • Have thrifty bob buy crusher scrap. I mean, he does run a salvage ship.
  • Stick a box of derringer ammo somewhere out there, without a gun
  • Add the expansion upgrade for borgs to the crate loot table. I've seen this upgrade on the wiki, but have never seen it in-game
  • Add some magic mushrooms to various dank areas


Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - misto - 08-20-2015

making old-mining public access, or unpowered so you could just pry it open easily, is kinda neat. ppl could stash all sorts of bodies or build all sorts of secret bases/bars/clubs in there then. its not like anybody's using the place for anything officially, it wouldnt get in anyones way

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - BaneOfGiygas - 08-20-2015

Marquesas Wrote:
BaneOfGiygas Wrote:typically just end up getting a bunch of cats when you do

Due to the way it's randomized you have a pretty hefty chance of getting a Voltron.
Huh. I must be pretty unlucky, then, because I can count the number of Voltrons I've ever gotten from abandoned crates on one hand.

I also agree on the drones, or would at the very least prefer that they not be all over the place, primarily because the amount of available pod weaponry (you've got phasers, drills, and lasers if there's armory access, which are fairly scarce and the former two aren't really stellar weapons against things like HKs) isn't very conducive to exploring space, which means you'll usually be running away from drones more frequently than fighting them. I also agree on the front of making the mining station public access, since as misto said, no one's using it for anything official anyways, and it's not like there's anything there that people without mining access shouldn't have.

I agree with the bulk of Noah's suggestions, and there's definitely a lot of tiny and interesting locales that have just about zip, nada, and zilch in the way of interesting loot. Maybe put some royal jelly or cubic bee eggs on the bee station, throw in a small Syndicate item of some ilk (a stealth storage, a microbomb implant, something) on the Z-Drone, put more cool stuff in fermid hell aside from an easter egg and a few assorted mining tools, populate those gigantic and empty asteroids with some mineral veins or some other cool pieces of loot, and mix up the contents of abandoned crates so the available good stuff isn't so limited.

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Marquesas - 08-20-2015

Noah Buttes Wrote:Hide things in toilets, why do none of the toilets anywhere EVER HIDE ANYTHING!?
This is blatant lies, fyi.

Noah Buttes Wrote:Make the clown car repairable
Heh [Image: dnTjV.gif]

Re: Add telescience blocks on the mining Z-level - Zafhset - 08-20-2015

If we're talking about adding stuff from other places into the mining z-level, I wouldn't mind seeing some of the VR drones appear there - more variety, if anything.