[MERGED PR] Random gang member selection at roundstart

[DummySian]

Classic regular with over 4000 rounds played on classic, and no, you don't need 'meta knowledge' to survive on classic. I've seen people do gimmicks (and really good ones) without using any meta stuff and most people i had interractions with actually enjoy just doing their own thing, like making bunch of food as chef, growing very weird plants (and deadly ones too as antag...) as a botanist and other stuff. No insuls taken, no sunglasses rushed. Telling people that classic needs you to use meta knowledge as much as possible is complete lie and just scares people that want to try playing classic off.

Now to the gangs, IMO the issue with gangs is that rarely anybody actually wants to be in a gang, fight against gangs or anything else. Gangs rounds are pretty boring for normal crew: gangs usually don't care about civillians, and if they do, they probably reached a state where 5 people walk around killing literally anyone (because the main goal of gangs is actually...boring? You can just make a lot of pipeguns, shove them in a locker and get a bunch of points. As far as i seen, no gang cared about winning ever, and people only tag locations until they get enough points to buy janktank). Normal crew can also not want to be in a gang and just do their job but with new change you can't even say no to rolling gang member which sometimes leads people to being less active in the gang (or just killing themselves lol).

For the gang members, i already mentioned 2 issues before and it's that main gang goal seems pretty boring to people on classic so they stick to rampaging and that you cant say no to rolling gang member so people end up being less active and helpful. What i noticed last time i rolled gang member is that it rolls afk people a lot. While others had full active gangs, 2 of our people were ssd since roundstart (im pretty sure one woke up like 30 minutes in tho..).

So we have that gangs usually cant make the round fun in general, maybe only for the people that rolled gang member if, of course, they even wanted to roll it... No matter if gang members are choosed randomly or not, its either gang gets fully killed early on because people dont wanna deal with 10 antags, or crew chooses to let them do things for a bit and it ends up in these people being stacked on very op janktank (that lets you survive lawbringer magdump) and stun gear and just walk around killing.

So basically, i'd prefer if gangs were removed from classic for a while and were reworked to be a little better or fully replaced. Gangs being on RP at least makes sense to me tho...

[Gamebot26]

Just played a round with this enabled, holy shit it was so good. No more getting rolled at round start by gangs that already have max members and only robust people, all gangs start on (almost) even footing now.

[PowerfulXtian]

Goon 1 regular here, also huge lover of the gang gamemode and even recently overhauled the wiki page for it. Apologies if I missed any points, but I'm voicing my own opinion on this.

Gang is the only mode where people who want to get involved can get involved and is one of those modes where it's basically an "all crew hands on deck" type of thing where the station completely plunges into chaotic brawling, like revolution in a sense. It's fun. Granted, some people are more robust than others and some people, and some people will try to abuse that to create the dream team of a gang.

However, I don't believe a big part of gang, which is recruitment should be changed just because of this. It's fun once in a while to just fight in ss13. Ignoring the slowness of doing your job (COUGH COUGH NOVA BRIGHT), the slowness of waiting for your turn as an antagonist, and the slowness of waiting for something intresting to occur. Even to the point of a rampage at least slightly curing boredom. Gang would honestly feel like just another game-mode that gives assigned antagonists to everyone, as do the rest of the gamemodes instead of recruiting those who are itching for a fight and becoming an antagonist.

[Silent Majority]

I think hop and detective should be explicitly excluded from gang

[Bonkey_Kong]

(If this isn't in effect anymore my B I didn't notice)

I like the idea of trying to move away from letting turbonerds just pick the top 5 most robust players and murderboning all game cause I think that's lame. Although I liked signing up for gangs (since I like action) having it be random is probably better then the current system (and a lot less frustrating for the leaders of the gang.)

In terms of actually stopping murder though, I'm not sure it would. I played a round as a gang member not too long ago and the shuttle got called in like 20 minutes because all of security was murdered by the gangs instantly. And my own gang experience wasn't exactly casualty free.

I feel like this change is a decent step forward. But the core issue of this game mode that people don't like seems to be kind of similar to what TG's heretic problem was (and might still be idk), in that people focus too much on the violence and not on the other cool parts of the antag like spells and all that. In order to stop murderboning you've got to dissuade murder and encourage another style of play.

But hey I don't know I'm just throwing my thoughts out there. Hope this at all helped.

[Kotlol]

I think hop and detective should be explicitly excluded from gang

HoP and Det as antags are already SUPER POWERFUL.
For conspirarors it's fine.
For gangs they give a gang a super unfair advantage.

So I agree with this.

Keep as solo antagonists. Not in team based ones like gangs. Conspirators is fine as they aren't as bad and the only antagonists per round.